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Author Topic: XLibre, finally and fortunately.  (Read 6387 times)

Fred vS

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #30 on: June 09, 2026, 03:48:57 pm »
Artix distro as switched to XLibre by default recently.

Note that Artix offers several flavors of WM all using XLibre (see picture).
« Last Edit: June 09, 2026, 03:52:43 pm by Fred vS »
I use Lazarus 2.2.0 32/64 and FPC 3.2.2 32/64 on Debian 11 64 bit, Windows 10, Windows 7 32/64, Windows XP 32,  FreeBSD 64.
Widgetset: fpGUI, MSEgui, Win32, GTK2, Qt.

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Fred vS

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #31 on: June 09, 2026, 04:34:20 pm »
One remark: the development team seems quite small, I think Lazarus/FPC sized, I may be wrong, which is a risk for such fundamental software, much more so than for Lazarus/FPC.

Yes, the number of highly skilled X11 developers is limited (around ten), and the lead developer is Enrico Weigelt (a very prolific former Xorg contributor who handles the vast majority of source code cleanup, ABI overhauls, and security improvements).

But there are also about twenty others who contribute to package management and distribution integration.

And there are dozens of other developers who test and comment on every commit or pull request.

I must say, I've never seen a project with so many daily contributions and pull requests, and this without interruption for a whole year.

Not to mention the impressive speed with which they respond to each issue and proposition of users and always find a solution.

Amen.  O:-)
« Last Edit: June 09, 2026, 04:49:50 pm by Fred vS »
I use Lazarus 2.2.0 32/64 and FPC 3.2.2 32/64 on Debian 11 64 bit, Windows 10, Windows 7 32/64, Windows XP 32,  FreeBSD 64.
Widgetset: fpGUI, MSEgui, Win32, GTK2, Qt.

https://github.com/fredvs
https://gitlab.com/fredvs
https://codeberg.org/fredvs

Fred vS

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #32 on: June 09, 2026, 05:18:57 pm »
Fred, have you tried a XLibre install on a "x11 free" system ? eg "With Fedora 44, that fallback is completely removed for GNOME and KDE Plasma installations."

Hello Davo.

No sorry.

It is entirely possible to install XLibre on Fedora 44, but because Fedora 44 officially removed native X11 support in GNOME 50, you must perform a couple of extra steps to make it.

(With some help of Gemini):

Add the repo:
Code: Bash  [Select][+][-]
  1. sudo dnf copr enable @xlibre/xlibre-xserver

Install the session files and the display server together:
Code: Bash  [Select][+][-]
  1. sudo dnf install gnome-session-xsession xorg-x11-server-Xorg xlibre-xserver xlibre-xf86-input-libinput

I use Lazarus 2.2.0 32/64 and FPC 3.2.2 32/64 on Debian 11 64 bit, Windows 10, Windows 7 32/64, Windows XP 32,  FreeBSD 64.
Widgetset: fpGUI, MSEgui, Win32, GTK2, Qt.

https://github.com/fredvs
https://gitlab.com/fredvs
https://codeberg.org/fredvs

tooknox

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2026, 06:15:57 pm »

I must say, I've never seen a project with so many daily contributions and pull requests, and this without interruption for a whole year.

Not to mention the impressive speed with which they respond to each issue and proposition of users and always find a solution.

Amen.  O:-)

I am part of multiple forums and the negativity around this fork was a shocker. Wayland enthusiasts kept dunking on wherever it got mentioned. It's good to see Xlibre is going strong. It's always good to have an alternative, and a display server not being a hostage to RH/IBM is even better.

Thaddy

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #34 on: June 09, 2026, 06:37:12 pm »
Amen.  O:-)
Well, it seems I am a tester now  O:-)
I am in no way negative to such alternatives. Just like to walk mainstream and not fight it.
It stays niche, even if some little known distro's support it. (I am strictly Debian which is very conservative)

But compliments for the instructions: no issues at all.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2026, 07:25:05 am by Thaddy »
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kagamma

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #35 on: June 10, 2026, 06:50:42 am »
I've been running Arch with XLibre for awhile. The reason is pretty simple: I like functional software :)
The only thing I miss from wayland is waydroid, which 12to11 fails to run it properly. So now I have to run the thing inside gamescope instead.

Thaddy

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #36 on: June 10, 2026, 08:49:03 am »
The reason is pretty simple: I like functional software :)
There is a reason all top 5 distro's use Wayland. A good reason.
What is missing is good server support. Not the visual aspects.
It just takes a change of mindset.
In the past, everything was better.

I actually got to like the constraints Wayland enforces.
- even the Gimp looks better. Brilliant software, seriously lacking UI design.
- and the Lazarus IDE looks better in docked mode. The docked mode has no issues with Wayland.

(I assume that any developer has at least two monitors for serious programming. If you can't because of financial issues I am happy to donate two monitors (new, I have to order them), just send a private message and we work that out only considering shipping, same as with the Raspberry Pi's, usually that is also free as some of you know. Note I am affluent but not rich: 2 monitors for two different people)
« Last Edit: June 10, 2026, 09:28:26 am by Thaddy »
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kagamma

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #37 on: June 10, 2026, 12:15:10 pm »
(I assume that any developer has at least two monitors for serious programming. If you can't because of financial issues I am happy to donate two monitors (new, I have to order them), just send a private message and we work that out only considering shipping, same as with the Raspberry Pi's, usually that is also free as some of you know. Note I am affluent but not rich: 2 monitors for two different people)
I have 3 monitors: 2 144Hz monitors for gaming and 1 wacom cintiq 16 for drawing. I also have a VR headset, which itself counts as a monitor as well :)
This is also one of the reasons I prefer X: I like my software to remember the positions of their windows across my monitors, which wayland still couldn't do the last time I checked.

Seenkao

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2026, 04:33:21 am »
Я несколько раз пытался поставить Wayland, но каждый раз, при его использовании я сталкивался с проблемами. И первая проблема  - это когда твоя машина зависает, а выйти в режим экранной строки невозможно (Ctrl + Alt + F1/F2/F3/F4/F5/F6/F7). Если вы этим не пользуетесь или не знали об этом, то я вас вполне пойму, но я хочу продолжать работу на компьютере, где основной графический режим сдох, и возможно выяснить проблему этого. Wayland такой возможности не предоставляет. Это защита? Я не думаю, это должен быть мой выбор, а не предоставленная мне функциональность.

Вторая проблема проявилась позже, я уже точно не опишу её, но было дело всё на эмуляторе. Вроде бы Wayland неплохо себя показал при работе на эмуляторе, но вот второй раз уже невозможно было запустить рабочий стол после перезагрузки эмулятора (ну и как я выше писал, нет возможности выйти в режим экранной строки).

В общем, это до сих пор сырая поделка, которую пропихивают, но ремонтировать многое не собираются, как я понимаю.

Что по XLibre? У меня стоит Debian 13 + Cinnamon. При работе с XOrg по умолчанию Cinnamon может упасть, и часто это замечалось именно при работе с FPC/Lazarus. Сменив XOrg на XLibre - я получил достаточно неплохой результат, когда падения Cinnamon прекратились и я с такими ситуациями почти не сталкиваюсь.
- Почему почти? Ведь я за этот период так ни разу и не столкнулся больше с такой ситуацией. Почти - по той причине, что я пока не могу сказать что абсолютно всё хорошо, пройдёт лет 10, и если проблема не проявится, значит её починили. И это должно происходить везде!!! А не делать отписки, что "это не наши проблемы" или "мы не будем этим заниматься", как зачастую делают разработчики Wayland.

Да, Xlibre стал намного более стабилен во многих мелких проблемах по сравнению с XOrg, изменений много и они заметны зачастую и не вооружённым глазом.

Давайте отметим то, что у меня нет претензий к разработчикам Wayland. Всё что я выше писал, это больше мои наблюдения и наблюдения людей которые сталкивались с проблемами при работе с Wayland. И меня больше всего раздражает то, что людям стараются навязать сырой продукт, и люди верят и пользуются этим продуктом (общественность - не разработчики). При этом поливая грязью X11 (XOrg/XLibre). И так же при этом, не пользуясь иксами...

 Относитесь с уважением друг к другу! Тогда у вас будет достаточно конструктивный диалог.
Всего хорошего!


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Google translate:
I tried installing Wayland several times, but each time I encountered problems. The first problem is when your machine freezes and you can't access the on-screen prompt (Ctrl + Alt + F1/F2/F3/F4/F5/F6/F7). If you don't use this or didn't know about it, I understand, but I want to continue working on a computer where the primary graphics mode has died and possibly figure out the problem. Wayland doesn't offer this option. Is this a security measure? I don't think so; it should be my choice, not the functionality provided to me.

The second problem appeared later; I can't describe it exactly, but it happened on the emulator. Wayland seemed to work well on the emulator, but the second time, I couldn't start the desktop after restarting the emulator (and, as I mentioned above, there's no way to access the on-screen prompt).

Basically, it's still a crude product that's being pushed around, but they don't intend to fix much of it, as far as I understand.

What about XLibre? I have Debian 13 + Cinnamon. When running XOrg, Cinnamon can crash by default, and I've often noticed this when running FPC/Lazarus. After switching to XLibre, I got a pretty good result: Cinnamon crashes stopped, and I rarely encounter such issues.
- Why almost? After all, I haven't encountered such a situation again since then. I say almost because I can't yet say everything is absolutely fine. It'll take 10 years, and if the problem doesn't reappear, it's probably been fixed. And this should happen everywhere!!! Instead of issuing formal replies like "it's not our problem" or "we won't work on it," as Wayland developers often do.

Yes, Xlibre has become much more stable in many minor issues compared to XOrg. There are many changes, and they're often noticeable to the naked eye.

Let's note that I have no complaints about the Wayland developers. Everything I wrote above is more my observations and the observations of people who have encountered problems with Wayland. What irritates me most is that they're trying to force a half-baked product on people, and they trust and use it (the public, not the developers). Meanwhile, they're throwing mud at X11 (XOrg/XLibre). And also, without using X...

Be respectful of each other! Then you'll have a fairly constructive dialogue.
All the best!
« Last Edit: June 11, 2026, 04:45:54 am by Seenkao »
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AmatCoder

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2026, 04:41:07 am »
I must say, I've never seen a project with so many daily contributions and pull requests, and this without interruption for a whole year.

What?
Even Lazarus has more contributions than X11Libre:

Lazarus Top 5 (last year):
  • Martin - 906 commits
  • zeljan1 - 904 commits
  • Juha - 522 commits
  • rich2014 - 399 commits
  • mattias - 357 commits

X11Libre Top 5 (last year):
  • metux - 1,647 commits
  • stefan11111 - 386 commits
  • whot - 59 commits
  • alanc - 43 commits
  • mikedld - 31 commits

X11Libre is, basically, an one-man effort.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2026, 04:52:23 am by AmatCoder »

Seenkao

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #40 on: June 11, 2026, 04:53:53 am »
AmatCoder, хорошее сравнение. Почему не взята статистика за 10 лет? А всего лишь за два года.
Хотя Xlibre ещё даже года нет.

Даже при таких условиях, я думаю не один человек занимается Xlibre, И уж тем более не один он делает поддержку разных дистрибутивов. Но вы почему-то об этом забываете.

Google translate:
AmatCoder, good comparison. Why aren't statistics for 10 years taken? Just two years.
Even though Xlibre isn't even a year old yet.

Even so, I don't think there's just one person working on Xlibre, much less supporting various distributions. But for some reason, you're forgetting that.
Rus: Стремлюсь к созданию минимальных и достаточно быстрых приложений.

Eng: I strive to create applications that are minimal and reasonably fast.
Working on ZenGL

Fred vS

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Re: XLibre, finally and fortunately.
« Reply #41 on: June 11, 2026, 06:20:26 am »
I must say, I've never seen a project with so many daily contributions and pull requests, and this without interruption for a whole year.

What?


Compare it with the commits of Wayland: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/commits/main?ref_type=heads
I use Lazarus 2.2.0 32/64 and FPC 3.2.2 32/64 on Debian 11 64 bit, Windows 10, Windows 7 32/64, Windows XP 32,  FreeBSD 64.
Widgetset: fpGUI, MSEgui, Win32, GTK2, Qt.

https://github.com/fredvs
https://gitlab.com/fredvs
https://codeberg.org/fredvs

 

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