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Author Topic: OPM, some issues  (Read 2885 times)

backprop

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OPM, some issues
« on: December 21, 2024, 08:45:49 pm »
The first major problem is that "Install" button force download package even it is downloaded.

I have downloaded all packages which is more that 750M of archives, thus downloading again package when try to install it is pointless, unless package is changed. Zip download is deleted automatically after extraction. That is definitely wrong choice.

Many packages require dependencies thus these will be forced to download as well. You have many ways to check archive integrity, simply use it instead to make it to be default behavior as it have no sense.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2024, 09:07:41 pm by backprop »

TRon

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2024, 09:06:26 pm »
Strange. My OPM tells me which packages are already installed so that I don't make the mistake of installing a package again (unless I wish to force it).

But anyhows, in case you think things can be done better then feel free to supply a patch.
I do not have to remember anything anymore thanks to total-recall.

backprop

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2024, 09:14:08 pm »
The second issue is annoying hints when hover mouse over package name. Often will not close. Why not simply allow help entry on right mouse button? That is much more logical instead to force users to look something not of interest, known already, etc.

backprop

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2024, 09:16:55 pm »
And third, if compilation and installation fail it is just unclear choice what is done in that case, especially if selected many packages to be installed at once.

All packages should be prune to such failure, but it is clear that that is not possible to achieve through all kind of FPC/Lazarus versions. Anyway, current way of handling such failures is not nearly well done.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2024, 09:23:08 pm by backprop »

TRon

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2024, 09:18:51 pm »
Yes, that is something that I can at least agree to. The popup is annoying as hell. Especially on wayland with its default animated windows (yes, I stay away from Wayland until it resembles something of adolescence but do on occasion test to experience/verify existing reports).

Hint you can press escape to get rid of the popup in case you are not able to get rid of it otherwise.

You can shut those off in the options settings btw.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2024, 09:21:45 pm by TRon »
I do not have to remember anything anymore thanks to total-recall.

backprop

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2024, 09:46:00 pm »
And the last one... Filtering is quite limited and mostly useless.

I often test some group of packages and if they are not what I'm looking for I want to remove it. However, there is no way to filter only these packages already fully or partially installed, etc. Instead all available packages are listed.

For that purpose, datetime of package installation and filtering/list by that would be quite useful.
Etc...

I have impression that OPM is created for amateurs who have no clue what they doing, not as a tool to keep all "useful" available packages in one place. Thus many settings are wrongly set by default (including destructive behavior), some packages are broken and still there, etc. That need to be changed.

 Look similar tool in Netbeans, for instance. There is no need to reinvent the wheel and making things quite weird...
« Last Edit: December 21, 2024, 09:49:06 pm by backprop »

wp

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2024, 10:29:40 pm »
Zip download is deleted automatically after extraction.
See Options > "Delete downloaded zip files after installation/update"

Many packages require dependencies thus these will be forced to download as well.
Options > "Always force download and extract"

The second issue is annoying hints when hover mouse over package name.
Options > Quick info for repository packages > Off

if compilation and installation fail it is just unclear choice what is done in that case
Open the package in "Packages" > "Open Package File", press "Compile", and the IDE will give you more details.

especially if selected many packages to be installed at once.
Although the checkboxes are tempting to do this, no - install packages one by one especially if they are new to you and you don't know what to expect.

All packages should be prune to such failure, but it is clear that that is not possible to achieve through all kind of FPC/Lazarus versions. Anyway, current way of handling such failures is not nearly well done.
The problem is that many packages once they made their way into OPM are poorly maintained. And the sources of many are out of reach for the Lazarus devs. I sometimes think that we should be more strict to remove packages. But how do you know that a package is not working? You must download it, install it on various combinations combinations of Lazarus/FPC and operating systems. That's a full-time job with more than 200 packages! I won't do this.

And the last one... Filtering is quite limited and mostly useless.

I often test some group of packages and if they are not what I'm looking for I want to remove it. However, there is no way to filter only these packages already fully or partially installed, etc. Instead all available packages are listed.

For that purpose, datetime of package installation and filtering/list by that would be quite useful.

Write a patch so that it does what you need - this is open source.

That need to be changed.
I like these words...

CharlyTango

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2024, 10:03:08 am »
I still come from the days of Delphi2. There was no help to install packagas/components and it could easily take 8 hours to install a suitable development environment. I don't know if Delphi now has a way to install components automatically.
Lazarus didn't have it for a long time either. But thanks to GetMem's initiative there is now OPM and this tool has saved me hours of installations.
A lot of unpaid time has gone into this tool and certainly also a lot of money, because for OPM to work it also needs the necessary infrastructure.

You don't have to use this tool if you don't like it.

I have downloaded all packages which is more that 750M of archives, thus downloading again package when try to install it is pointless, unless package is changed. Zip download is deleted automatically after extraction.

I don't know how anyone can come up with the idea of installing all packages. But you can do what you like. OPM is an online installation tool and certainly not built for local caching of packages.

That is definitely wrong choice.

That might be your opinion. Have you ever asked the author why he had done it this way?

I have impression that OPM is created for amateurs who have no clue what they doing, not as a tool to keep all "useful" available packages in one place.

Of course OPM is also for amateurs to make installation easier. Professionals always know how to help themselves or ask politely in the forum

Of course, OPM has pros and cons like any other application and may not suit everyone. There may even be conceptual problems or missing functions

But if you are the professional you claim to be, then it is probably easy for you to incorporate all the functions and variants that you are currently criticising. After all, it's open source for your benefit. You can even create a completely new package with incomparably better functionality and an extraordinary range of functions.
So get stuck in and just do it.

But until that happens, you can request, ask, suggest, but by no means demand.



Lazarus stable, Win32/64

backprop

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Re: OPM, some issues
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2024, 03:59:50 pm »
I  have no constant and fast internet and that is the reason why I downloaded all packages and tested some I needed. You clearly insinuating. Read carefully what is wrote.

And I have started from Delphi 7 Studio Pro and ended with. I can remember that Borland provided only source for RTL in order to create new .dcu and nothing else. Thus there is different mechanism to "install components" and no need to recompile executable to add new component or upgrades on RTL.

Unfortunately, what you do is just common behavior on this forum. Insinuations, rudeness and in general hostile behavior. Just try to avoid that and focus on facts.

I still come from the days of Delphi2. There was no help to install packagas/components and it could easily take 8 hours to install a suitable development environment. I don't know if Delphi now has a way to install components automatically.
Lazarus didn't have it for a long time either. But thanks to GetMem's initiative there is now OPM and this tool has saved me hours of installations.
A lot of unpaid time has gone into this tool and certainly also a lot of money, because for OPM to work it also needs the necessary infrastructure.

You don't have to use this tool if you don't like it.

I have downloaded all packages which is more that 750M of archives, thus downloading again package when try to install it is pointless, unless package is changed. Zip download is deleted automatically after extraction.

I don't know how anyone can come up with the idea of installing all packages. But you can do what you like. OPM is an online installation tool and certainly not built for local caching of packages.

That is definitely wrong choice.

That might be your opinion. Have you ever asked the author why he had done it this way?

I have impression that OPM is created for amateurs who have no clue what they doing, not as a tool to keep all "useful" available packages in one place.

Of course OPM is also for amateurs to make installation easier. Professionals always know how to help themselves or ask politely in the forum

Of course, OPM has pros and cons like any other application and may not suit everyone. There may even be conceptual problems or missing functions

But if you are the professional you claim to be, then it is probably easy for you to incorporate all the functions and variants that you are currently criticising. After all, it's open source for your benefit. You can even create a completely new package with incomparably better functionality and an extraordinary range of functions.
So get stuck in and just do it.

But until that happens, you can request, ask, suggest, but by no means demand.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2024, 05:15:55 pm by backprop »

 

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