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Author Topic: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!  (Read 90176 times)


aidv

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2015, 11:17:40 pm »
I was expecting this.

Now it's going to become a dinosaur software for real and it is going to stop existing in small developers heads.

JuhaManninen

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2015, 12:16:09 am »
This may be good for Delphi's future. The new owner is a technically oriented DB company. Delphi supplements its business well.
The current owner of Embarcadero is an investment company.

It will be interesting to see if the new owner wants to offer something cheap for hobbyists. My prediction is that they will, after they feel secure about their market share.
I also predict that Delphi will continue gaining market share.

All in all this is good news for everybody!
Mostly Lazarus trunk and FPC 3.2 on Manjaro Linux 64-bit.

taazz

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2015, 12:43:31 am »
Quote from: businesswire
SAN FRANCISCO--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Thoma Bravo, a leading private equity investment firm, today announces the sale of Embarcadero Technologies, a leading provider of software solutions for application and database development, to Idera, Inc., an application and server management software provider.
delphi happens to be part of embarcadero. As for the buyer they seem to be a Database house they are after embarcaderos database line of products for sure and we will see how they are going to handle the rest of the products. Just to clarify being a simple supplement to their main business is not a good thing when we are talking about a programming environment. I would not like to see loosing power in markets like mobile or desktop in favor of linux server environments or even worst moving focus from a general purpose developing environment to an exclusively DB focused environment. Being a side note to the main business means that you are alive as long as it is profitable for their main business.
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Leledumbo

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2015, 05:10:05 am »
Hopefully they will have sane pricing plans.

BitBangerUSA

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2015, 06:05:16 am »
Hopefully they will have sane pricing plans.

that would be nice.
we can hope...
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tr_escape

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2015, 07:25:09 am »
What is the most sold as second hand development software ?

- Delphi

Maybe years later we can ask new programmers...


hnb

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2015, 09:40:51 am »
I also predict that Delphi will continue gaining market share.

All in all this is good news for everybody!

With Lazarus and FPC I don't need Delphi anymore :). I see only few missing elements in comparison with Delphi:

-Project Manager with Projects Group (my next TODO)
-Anonymous Methods
-Generics bug fixes and Generics.Collections ;) as part of FPC RTL/Lazarus
-RTTI.pas and few low level details

P.S. Delphi Nextgen is toy language in comparison with FPC (especially for mobile platforms)...
Checkout NewPascal initiative and donate beer - ready to use tuned FPC compiler + Lazarus for mORMot project

best regards,
Maciej Izak

JuhaManninen

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2015, 11:50:27 am »
With Lazarus and FPC I don't need Delphi anymore :). I see only few missing elements in comparison with Delphi:

-Project Manager with Projects Group (my next TODO)

It seems to be the next ToDo for many people. You were not the first one to mention it.
Don't do anything for it before consulting Mattias. I have understood he already has code for it but has not committed yet.
I will write to him. There is a danger that people make duplicate effort without knowing about each others' work.

Quote
-Anonymous Methods
-Generics bug fixes and Generics.Collections ;) as part of FPC RTL/Lazarus
-RTTI.pas and few low level details

We have a little different priorities. I think Lazarus misses badly :
- Projects Group (already mentioned)
- Solid and easy Unicode support
- Integrated Pascal debugger to get rid of GDB and its bugs + limitations
- A way to search and install online packages from global repositories

However the biggest problem for many projects will always be the lack of:
- High quality 3rd party components!

The open source multiplatform system is problematic for component vendors, most of them do not support Lazarus.
It also prevents converting most Delphi projects to Lazarus, even if we make LCL perfectly compatible with VCL.
On the other hand open source process provides many benefits for development. There will be more high quality open source components, too (hopefully).

This all means that both Delphi and Lazarus will have place in the world also in the future.
What more, all the current and future forks of Lazarus will have place in the world, too. The essence of open source is to copy and improve other people's code, and publish it for others to copy. Let's follow it! Let's copy and improve shamelessly.
(For more info about the essence of GPL, please read the history about why Richard Stallman created it.)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 01:45:54 pm by JuhaManninen »
Mostly Lazarus trunk and FPC 3.2 on Manjaro Linux 64-bit.

Graeme

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2015, 12:29:32 pm »
Hopefully they will have sane pricing plans.
that would be nice.
we can hope...

Why? Nothing beats FREE and OPEN SOURCE. With Free Pascal, Lazarus, MSEide+MSEgui and fpGUI Toolkit, we have all the options we need. We can contribute and steer the direction of the projects, upgrade when needed, and they all have support for platforms Delphi can just dream of! I'm very happy with the tools I currently use.

The only thing I like these days about Delphi, is the fact that they promote the Object Pascal language. Other than that, I think they influence Free Pascal in the wrong way.
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Graeme

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2015, 12:32:11 pm »
Don't do anything for it before consulting Mattias. I have understood he already has code for it but has not committed yet.
Correct. Michael van Canneyt already implemented Project Groups, but recent changes in Lazarus IDE broken that branch. So we are waiting on Mattias to integrated it. At least this is what I was told by Michael.
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Bostjan

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2015, 12:53:34 pm »
We have a little different priorities. I think Lazarus misses badly :
- Projects Group (already mentioned)
- Solid and easy Unicode support
- Integrated Pascal debugger to get rid of GDB and its bugs + limitations
- A way to search and install online packages from global repositories

What is wrong with GDB ?
- supports many platforms and cpu arhitectures
- it is widely used
- it has a long history so it's tested and proven

If it was bad solution then I think community would already come with alternative solution but aside of lldb there is not much (except for proprietray ms and intel debugers).
So why reinvent the wheel and make own debuger ?

Sorry for offtopic, but I am really interested in this.

Graeme

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2015, 01:25:13 pm »
What is wrong with GDB ?
- supports many platforms and cpu arhitectures
- it is widely used
- it has a long history so it's tested and proven

So why reinvent the wheel and make own debuger ?
A lot! GDB licensing is not always ideal - eg on FreeBSD. GDB is not much geared towards the language features of Object Pascal.

If you compare Delphi's debugger to what you get with GDB in Lazarus - GDB looks like the stone ages! Haiku's new debugger also shows what can be done if you implement your own - they have some brilliant features.

The other problem is that GDB is out of our control, so if there is a bug or a Object Pascal language feature not supported, it takes forever to implement (in C++ or C language), we have to wait for integration, then wait for the next GDB release etc etc. If it was implemented in Object Pascal, it can be fixed immediately and everybody benefits straight away.

There are already Object Pascal based debuggers in the works.... Duby, fpdebug - my fork of Duby (https://github.com/graemeg/fpdebug), and then the debugger included in Lazarus (/components/fpdebug/). Granted, I haven't had much time to work on my 'fpdebug' project in a while, but the basics is there. The one include with Lazarus is progressing nicely too.
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Zath

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2015, 01:55:30 pm »
Very interesting.
This news has made me rethink my plans for finally buying a new version of Delphi. The last one I bought was Delphi 5 Enterprise. I still refer to its manual although its split into two pieces now.
I can't see them making it open source if the current pricing provides a useful revenue stream. That said, if the pricing was reduced to a less daunting level, I'm pretty sure I would buy a newer version.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 02:50:29 pm by Zath »

JuhaManninen

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Re: Embarcadero Delphi is sold!
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2015, 02:02:07 pm »
What is wrong with GDB ?
- supports many platforms and cpu arhitectures
- it is widely used
- it has a long history so it's tested and proven

GDB with Pascal is a real PITA, especially on Windows! Here some issues:
  http://wiki.freepascal.org/GDB_Debugger_Tips#Known_Problems_.2F_Errors_reported_by_the_IDE
I believe you have also seen the GDB crash error with "We are pulling the plug" message.
A serious inherent limitation is that property getters cannot be read. It leads to a frustrating debugging experience compared to Delphi for example.
The GDB's codebase is old and messy. Only few people dare to touch it, and those people are not interested in Pascal.

Quote
If it was bad solution then I think community would already come with alternative solution but aside of lldb there is not much (except for proprietray ms and intel debugers).

There is fpdebug included in Lazarus trunk as Graeme mentioned. It already works reasonably well, you can try it yourself.
Mostly Lazarus trunk and FPC 3.2 on Manjaro Linux 64-bit.

 

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