What about a more modern IDE?

[Gosh]

Not related, to the topic, but a project with 45 forms is a application bad design (for either MSVS, Mono or Lazarus).

According to books, it is not a good design, I agree. Unfortunately, sometimes you have to choose that bad design to solve some problem because you don't have a choice If I couldn't feel myself comfortable with 4 simple forms inside of Lazarus, what I could expect with 45?

Also, I have some strange and unexpected  errors/bugs in Lazarus IDE. Therefore I started a forum thread about that topic.

[Martin_fr]

- tab oriented editor

As in tab-key ( #9 ) handling indent?
Or as in Notebook-tabs?

In either case what is missing? Afaik both works.

[rvk]

The most important things should be
- tab oriented editor
- more functional project explorer (VS has excellent one)
- separated (and willingly dockable) object inspector

I didn't quite catch the fact if you've already tried the anchordockingdsgn-plugin? It has all of your points (except for the dockable form-designer).

It has some small issues... but what are your thoughts on that plugin?

When this plugin is perfected and stable it could become default.
Below a screenshot of the IDE.

[lagprogramming]

I think Gosh is looking for something like what hnb wanted to do with his FreeSparta fork. Hnb tried his best but wasn't enough.

[Gosh]

I didn't quite catch the fact if you've already tried the anchordockingdsgn-plugin? It has all of your points (except for the dockable form-designer).

It has some small issues... but what are your thoughts on that plugin?
When this plugin is perfected and stable it could become default.

I tried. it is a good direction but as you know it is rather buggy.

Why not to include such a nice thing out of box?

[Gosh]

Well... I've made a small effort to define an "ideal" Lazarus IDE with the elements which mainly already exist. That means, It is just needed to put all of these elements together and add a few things more.

I am waiting on critics 

[typo]

Well, my critic is that you should find a more long-lived way of expose your idea and wait for people to meditate about it.

[skalogryz]

I am waiting on critics 

The image doesn't show how would you like to handle 45 forms.

[airpas]

In the end you have to convince the lazarus team which i dont think they like your idea . Because If they did so they implement it while ago

[marcov]

In the end you have to convince the lazarus team which i dont think they like your idea . Because If they did so they implement it while ago

Most likely it is just not on their immediate priority list. Having wild ideas is fun, but the trick is not the idea (that is as old as the IDEs that he showcases and that probably most people in this thread already know).

The trick is to actually do something with it, and find a way to achieve such extra tasks without stalling general progress.

[Gosh]

The image doesn't show how would you like to handle 45 forms.

With a little bit better Project inspector and with supported tabs for forms and source code.

In the end you have to convince the lazarus team which i dont think they like your idea . Because If they did so they implement it while ago

I just can say that it is more than obvious that they are trying to keep design close to Delphi 7 as much as it is possible. Maybe they think that it is a proper way, God knows. I don't think so.

[rvk]

With a little bit better Project inspector and with supported tabs for forms and source code.

This is possible with the anchordockingdsgn-package. You just need to rearrange the windows a little. The Project Inspector is dockable. See my screenshot from before.

So why not see what's wrong with anchordockingdsgn (what bugs you can find) and try to get them resolved with the maintainer.

I just can say that it is more than obvious that they are trying to keep design close to Delphi 7 as much as it is possible. Maybe they think that it is a proper way, God knows.

No, you still don't understand the point. If you (or anyone else) can provide a stable plugin (for example a bugfree and stable anchordockingdsgn with form-designer dock) they will happily consider implementing it. But only if it's stable (which it is not at the moment). But it's not up to them to do the work. It's up to someone who wants to pick this up and put his or her valuable time into it.

[typo]

I just can say that it is more than obvious that they are trying to keep design close to Delphi 7 as much as it is possible. Maybe they think that it is a proper way, God knows. I don't think so.

I don't think so. I would bet that it is more believable that they don't want to change something that works well. And that appearance is not relevant. 

Surely there is not an active willing of keeping Lazarus like Delphi 7.

What happens it that maintaining Lazarus visually up-to-date is a lost fight for a group of people which likes numbers and code.

[JuhaManninen]

In the end you have to convince the lazarus team which i dont think they like your idea . Because If they did so they implement it while ago

I just can say that it is more than obvious that they are trying to keep design close to Delphi 7 as much as it is possible. Maybe they think that it is a proper way, God knows. I don't think so.

I think this is enough. Somebody has given me admin rights for this forum and I will use them to delete future posts from Gosh in this thread.
Gosh, you can still write in other more technically oriented threads but this road now is a dead-end.

From experience I know this can go on forever. It creates an avalance effect as we can see from the comment of eg. airpas.
The claims now shift to a direction saying Lazarus developers are evil and are against progress. Facts don't play a role any more, the only purpose is to prove that Lazarus sucks and it has no future and all other IDEs are better.
Clearly this fills the definition of a troll.
As explained, the real reason for slow progress is a lack of human resources, but this fact is always ignored for some reason.

A logical reaction would be to go away from such a hopeless project, but no ...
I would compare this to relations between people. If you dislike somebody, you don't go to ring his door-bell and explain that he is disgusting and has no future.
This forum is kind of "home" for Lazarus project. We don't want anti-Lazarus propaganda here. It only eats time and energy from everybody.
For example I have used LOTS of time and my limited brain capacity for some IDE improvements in version 1.4. I want to improve it more but it takes time.
Thus it has felt very frustrating to read this kind of nonsense.

Gosh can clear his "troll status" by actually improving the IDE and sending a valid patch.

[Blaazen]

Also, it was not mentioned here yet, there exists wiki page: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Category:Proposals

Gosh or anyone else can add ideas there.