Not wishing to Cut Nose/Spite face.

[Blaazen]

I wouldn't say that Qt and GTk2/3 is work of volunteer. Qt was owned by TrollTech, then Nokia and now Digia from Finland. In past, it had dual licensing for commercial and open source development.
GTk3 is mainly developed by RedHat people.

[MorbidFractal]

Beyond Mint, and other, Maintainers and Lazarus/FPC Maintainers I fail to see why us Lusers, hell desk reference, need to be involved. It would  appear that the issue exists and the issue is not Lazarus but rather someone else's concept of how it should be installed.

I would gratefully suffer Lazarus/FPC bugs if I could run it rather than deal with the pain of MEH and searching for a solution that delivers the same pain of MEH.

I shall refer you to Verity Stob,

http://search.theregister.co.uk/?q=Verity+Stob&advanced=1&author=&date=the+dawn+of+time&site=0&results_per_page=20

or,

http://search.theregister.co.uk/?q=Verity+Stob+Pascal&advanced=1&psite=0&author=&date=the+dawn+of+time&site=0&results_per_page=20

Somewhere in there you might get the impression that Pascal is important.

Oh.. and I could not write shit that does the shit you do.

[Cyrax]

If end user wants to bugs to be fixed in reasonable time frame in open source community and without paying for somebody, he/she/it needs to be much extremely verbose than usual. Not all developers uses same GUI/OS systems than users do.

[MorbidFractal]

If end user wants to bugs to be fixed in reasonable time frame in open source community and without paying for somebody, he/she/it needs to be much extremely verbose than usual. Not all developers uses same GUI/OS systems than users do.

No. It's supposed to be 'cross platform' so go deal with it. Martin suggested a VM.. Go install multiple ones and check out your code.

I would like to write  'proper' FOSS outside of my room but I am clueless given I do not know how to 'fix' your 'broken' thing. Apparently you might know how to.

No I'll retract that one.

I spend overheads attempting to fix your shit so it might work the way I would like or expect it to work and then it all falls over because you or someone else, with the best intentions, fucked up. I might be seriously disinclined to give such software to others in the knowledge that is going to fall over and fuck them over.

Please do tell me about it but try to avoid the 'Free as in Beer' argument.

In Perspective... If I Brewed a Shit Pint.. I WOULD NOT ASK SOMEONE TO DRINK IT

/caps/stuff

[Graeme]

Bugout is an external application which captures messages from your applications while they are being debugged,

A word of warning, if you are using SimpleIPC (similar to what the dbugintf unit included with FPC), then there is a bug under Windows. If you send too many messages per second, then SimpleIPC can't keep up and starts dropping messages. This doesn't happen under Linux or FreeBSD though.

fpGUI also has a debugging unit based on dbugintf, and also includes a Debug Server to capture those messages. But because of the Windows bug, I don't use it. Instead I use the tiLog unit included with the tiOPF project. There are various output writers - one is a LogToGUI which is really nice. All the tiLog logging is cached and thread based, so no dropping of messages and no slowing down of your applications. I use this a log. You might want to take a look at that too. Just thought I would mention it.

[Graeme]

Logging is an addition, not a substitute for a debugger.

+1
I can't agree more.  Kudos to Martin F. (and anybody else) for working so hard on improving GDB support and fpdebugger.

[Graeme]

I chose it because I assumed it would be the most reliable widget set being the oldest.

That was my assumption too, but clearly both of us were wrong. I think now most Lazarus developers work under LCL-Win32/Win64 and all the others LCL widgetsets lag behind in compatibility and features.

[Martin_fr]

Wow, lets calm down a bit....

You may have had a bad experience, but still look at the amount of people that try to help, and the size of the community, it cant be all that bad.

Even if we take out all the issues that are none Lazarus (and that are quite a few), which includes the OpenGl package that is not in the control of the Lazarus team you may still have been unlucky to be hit by so many issues.

The getlazarus version is provided by third party. It is based on code that is not yet released by the Lazarus team, and which when the team provided it itself came with a big warning that it is untested. Tests are done for the official releases.

Admittedly even for the releases only so many tests can be done. Some bugs may get overlooked. Others for reasons unexplained happen for users but not on any machine of a Lazarus developer (not even special set up VM). This sometimes means they cant be fixed for the time being. Yet others simply have to wait, if not enough manpower is available. Despite all the result is usually good enough to work.

With Linux (and that is the difference to windows) there are thousands of different versions, each distro is different, and exists in many versions, and users apply different subsets of updates. We can not test that many different versions all by our self.

----------------
Also you got a lot of help and feedback. And in short time too. But getting help also means you have to filter this help. Everyone has different approach on problem solving. Not every approach may help you.


----------------

As for which version of Lazarus: The best you can currently get is 1.4 RC3.
But you may want to contact the author of the opengl, if hsi package is ready for this. If not you can only use 1.2.6

Both have problems with align in scrollboxes (and *maybe( (I do not know, might be something else) the autoscroll you tried is affected too). So there is on immediate solution to that.

[Signal]

If end user wants to bugs to be fixed in reasonable time frame in open source community and without paying for somebody, he/she/it needs to be much extremely verbose than usual. Not all developers uses same GUI/OS systems than users do.

No. It's supposed to be 'cross platform' so go deal with it. Martin suggested a VM.. Go install multiple ones and check out your code.

I would like to write  'proper' FOSS outside of my room but I am clueless given I do not know how to 'fix' your 'broken' thing. Apparently you might know how to.

No I'll retract that one.

I spend overheads attempting to fix your shit so it might work the way I would like or expect it to work and then it all falls over because you or someone else, with the best intentions, fucked up. I might be seriously disinclined to give such software to others in the knowledge that is going to fall over and fuck them over.

Please do tell me about it but try to avoid the 'Free as in Beer' argument.

In Perspective... If I Brewed a Shit Pint.. I WOULD NOT ASK SOMEONE TO DRINK IT

/caps/stuff

Laz/FPC is a complex development environment that takes some time just to learn the basics of, let alone master. A number of people have bent over backwards to try and assist you. Your response is both childish and churlish. 

[Martin_fr]

I can't agree more.  Kudos to Martin F. (and anybody else) for working so hard on improving GDB support and fpdebugger.

Joost did a great deal of it too. (ANd Marc on the original code)

[munair]

With Linux (and that is the difference to windows) there are thousands of different versions, each distro is different, and exists in many versions, and users apply different subsets of updates. We can not test that many different versions all by our self.

For development on Linux I would suggest the more conservative distros. Ubuntu and Mint are packed with extra's to allow users a full experience out of the box. This is not a bad thing, but chances of instability become greater. Debian is very conservative but as a result also VERY stable. This is the environment you would want when doing serious software development. Debian allows me to use it for several years. That is why I use it and so far I have had no issues with Lazarus using GTK2 (Mate desktop).

Fedora, OpenSUSE, Mageia, to name a few, are also good distros, but their release cycle is much shorter as a result of which you are left with an unsupported system within 18 months or so.

I don't have experience with Lazarus on KDE/Qt. (Maybe Blaazen can share his experience).

I am not advocating Debian. I am just sharing my experience for those who want a stable development environment.

[munair]

Bug report filed:

http://bugs.freepascal.org/view.php?id=27843

[Blaazen]

I use Chakra Linux (it's rolling updates distro, versions of libraries and kernel are usually much newer than on Mint or *buntu), FPC trunk and Lazarus trunk +Qt for years and I have hardly ever problems. IMO Qt works now better than GTk2 (and is nicer).

I also sometimes run some Lazarus (stable or RC version) under Wine. It has some problems - mainly focusing and z-orer of windows, for example if you double click button on form designer, OnClick event is correctly created in Source Editor, but the editor does not come to front. But I guess it's Wine bug rather than Lazarus and Lazarus under Wine never crashed.

[zeljko]

Bug report filed:

http://bugs.freepascal.org/view.php?id=27843

It's unfixable (if it's bug I've noted there). libpixman must be rebuilded with --mstackrealign (affects 32bit IDE & apps only on linux gtk2),
or use Qt ide.

[Graeme]

I am not advocating Debian. I am just sharing my experience for those who want a stable development environment.

I fully agree with your post. Ubuntu LTS releases are really good for application development and stability.

If you want another VERY stable and consistent (things are clearly documented, defined and adhered too where they install etc) then try FreeBSD or PC-BSD (this being the "desktop friendly version" of FreeBSD). I got sick and tired of Linux constantly breaking or completely changing things between releases. So 4 years ago I switched to FreeBSD and have updated my system from 9.0, to 9.1, to 10.0 to 10.1 and it still runs run solid. I will definitely not be leaving FreeBSD any time soon - it is my perfect environment with very good backwards compatibility between releases.

ps:
From a desktop (available software and user experience) point of view, Linux and FreeBSD desktop environments are exactly the same. They both run the usual Mate, Gnome, KDE, or thousands of Window Managers available.