Lazarus

Announcements => Third party => Topic started by: avra on March 27, 2020, 02:09:06 pm

Title: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on March 27, 2020, 02:09:06 pm
Good news! I have contacted Mr. Maciej Kaczkowski, the author of TMapViewer which was the base for LazMapViewer, and he kindly agreed to change the license to any open source variant we like. I suggest we stick with the suggested https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL which is already used for RTL and LCL since it is most compatible with Lazarus and still allows commercial use. Although Maciej was the original author, to change the license we need all contributors of LazMapViewer to agree on this, so we need to find out the list of them. Looking at SVN history I can only see wp's contributions, but looking at https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,12674.0.htm l suspect that there are other contributors. Anyone who can bring light on this please step forward.

Here are our mails that Maciej kindly allowed me to post in the forum (I have changed them only by making our e-mail addresses unreadable):

Quote
2020-03-25 18:30 GMT+01:00, Maciej Kaczkowski <***@keit.co>:
> Hi,
>
> Yes, you can publish.
>
> Best regards
> Maciej Kaczkowski
>
> W dniu 24.03.2020 o 17:34, Zeljko Avramovic pisze:
>> Hello Mr. Kaczkowski,
>>
>> That is very nice of you and I thank you very much in the name of the
>> community. May I have your permission to publish our mail messages in
>> Lazarus forum to inform the community of the good news?
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> Zeljko Avramovic
>>
>> 2020-03-24 17:22 GMT+01:00, Maciej Kaczkowski <***@keit.co>:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I've only created the basis for this project. I'm no longer involved in
>>> it. If you need to connect to another project you can choose any Open
>>> Source license that will satisfy the community. Many changes have been
>>> made outside of me, if there is a will to change the license to another
>>> one, I accept it.
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>> Maciej Kaczkowski
>>>
>>>
>>> W dniu 23.03.2020 o 22:14, ***@keit.co pisze:
>>>> Nadawca: Zeljko Avramovic <***@gmail.com>
>>>> Temat: TMapViewer license
>>>>
>>>> Treść wiadomości:
>>>> Hello Mr. Kaczkowski,
>>>>
>>>> Some people from Lazarus community would would like to make extended
>>>> version of your TMapViewer downloadable from Lazarus via OPM (Online
>>>> Package Manager), and it would be really very nice if it could have the
>>>> same LGPL with linking exception license as RTL, LCL and many other
>>>> parts
>>>> of FreePascal and Lazarus already have. Whatever you decide, I want to
>>>> thank you for sharing your nice work with the community and wish you
>>>> the
>>>> best.
>>>>
>>>> Here is extended version of your component:
>>>> https://sourceforge.net/p/lazarus-ccr/svn/HEAD/tree/components/lazmapviewer/
>>>>
>>>> and here is modified LGPL license that we hope you can accept:
>>>> https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL
>>>> https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/licensing
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Zeljko Avramovic (user avra in Lazarus forum)

Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
I agree with the change of license.

The other major contributors beside Maciej are
- forum user "ti_dic" who contributed the thread administration and RGBAGraphics code (https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,12674.msg164556.html#msg164556)
- forum user "jc99" who contritbuted the BGRABitmap drawing engine (https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,47164.msg337229.html#msg337229).

There are also some minor contributions by other users with bug fixes. Do we need their agreement, too?
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on March 27, 2020, 02:49:02 pm
Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
I agree with the change of license.
Nice   :)

Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
The other major contributors beside Maciej are
- forum user "ti_dic" who contributed the thread administration and RGBAGraphics code (https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,12674.msg164556.html#msg164556)
- forum user "jc99" who contritbuted the BGRABitmap drawing engine (https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,47164.msg337229.html#msg337229).
I have just sent them a PM pointing to this topic.

Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
There are also some minor contributions by other users with bug fixes. Do we need their agreement, too?
If I get a list of them then I will contact them, too.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on March 27, 2020, 04:23:53 pm
Quote from: avra on March 27, 2020, 02:49:02 pm
Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
There are also some minor contributions by other users with bug fixes. Do we need their agreement, too?
If I get a list of them then I will contact them, too.
I scanned through some posts and found only "sstvmaster" (I thought there were more)
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: sstvmaster on March 27, 2020, 06:48:54 pm
I also agree with the change of license.

Maik @ sstvmaster
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on March 27, 2020, 06:50:03 pm
Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 04:23:53 pm
Quote from: avra on March 27, 2020, 02:49:02 pm
Quote from: wp on March 27, 2020, 02:34:27 pm
There are also some minor contributions by other users with bug fixes. Do we need their agreement, too?
If I get a list of them then I will contact them, too.
I scanned through some posts and found only "sstvmaster" (I thought there were more)
I have just sent him a PM. Regarding ti_dic and jc99, marcov has let me know that they have not been active for some time in the forum. I have seen that jc99 has a github page, so if he doesn't reply soon I will try to contact him there. I have also found that ti_dic has a page on sourceforge. If he doesn't reply here then I will try to contact him there.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on March 27, 2020, 10:49:18 pm
Quote from: sstvmaster on March 27, 2020, 06:48:54 pm
I also agree with the change of license.
Thank you!  :D
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on March 29, 2020, 12:06:05 pm
I have tried to contact ti_dic and jc99 through their repos. Hopefully they will see it and reply here. If anyone knows them or knows some other way to contact them then please step in.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: ti_dic on April 01, 2020, 10:20:37 pm
No problem for me,
i agree with the change of licence.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on April 02, 2020, 09:41:05 am
Quote from: ti_dic on April 01, 2020, 10:20:37 pm
No problem for me,
i agree with the change of licence.
Thank you! Very nice.  :D

If I recall correctly I think I have seen in some forum message that jc99 was also hanging in some German forum. If someone knows where then please help and let him know about this topic. On github he is joecare99 so some variant of that user name could also be used there.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on April 02, 2020, 09:53:32 am
There is a "jc99" in the German forum, indeed. I contacted him.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on April 02, 2020, 04:48:40 pm
Quote from: wp on April 02, 2020, 09:53:32 am
There is a "jc99" in the German forum, indeed. I contacted him.
Thank you!
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: jc99 on April 04, 2020, 06:46:59 pm
I also agree to the change
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: jc99 on April 04, 2020, 06:49:00 pm
Quote from: wp on April 02, 2020, 09:53:32 am
There is a "jc99" in the German forum, indeed. I contacted him.
By the way, I am ...
... I was relatively busy in the last weeks, we have a Corona-shutdown in our company and some things had to be done till then.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on April 06, 2020, 12:23:17 am
Quote from: jc99 on April 04, 2020, 06:46:59 pm
I also agree to the change
Yes! Thank you!  :D :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on April 06, 2020, 10:32:28 am
avra, you seem to be more experienced with licenses than I am. Is it ok when I replace the license header in the MapViewer source files by this

Quote
License: modified LGPL with linking exception (like RTL, FCL and LCL)
see: https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL

Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: marcov on April 06, 2020, 11:01:17 am
Quote from: wp on April 06, 2020, 10:32:28 am
avra, you seem to be more experienced with licenses than I am. Is it ok when I replace the license header in the MapViewer source files by this

Quote
License: modified LGPL with linking exception (like RTL, FCL and LCL)
see: https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL

Afaik you need at least a formal specification of copyright. Copyright is inalienable in some jurisdictions, but needs to be explicitely asserted in common law ones?
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on April 06, 2020, 11:11:27 am
Quote from: marcov on April 06, 2020, 11:01:17 am
Afaik you need at least a formal specification of copyright. Copyright is inalienable in some jurisdictions, but needs to be explicitely asserted in common law ones?

Of course, I wanted to keep the original copyright notes in the file. To be more specific, in mvMapViewer.pas the current header is
Code: Pascal  [Select][+][-]
  1. { (c) 2014 ti_dic MapViewer component for lazarus
  2.   Parts of this component are based on :
  3.     Map Viewer Copyright (C) 2011 Maciej Kaczkowski / keit.co
  4.  
  5.   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it
  6.   under the terms of the GNU Library General Public License as published by
  7.   the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your
  8.   option) any later version.
  9.  
  10.   This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but WITHOUT
  11.   ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or
  12.   FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the GNU Library General Public License
  13.   for more details.
  14.  
  15.   You should have received a copy of the GNU Library General Public License
  16.   along with this library; if not, write to the Free Software Foundation,
  17.   Inc., 59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307, USA.
  18. }

I want to replace it by
Code: Pascal  [Select][+][-]
  1. { (c) 2014 ti_dic MapViewer component for lazarus
  2.   Parts of this component are based on :
  3.     Map Viewer Copyright (C) 2011 Maciej Kaczkowski / keit.co
  4.  
  5.   License: modified LGPL with linking exception (like RTL, FCL and LCL)
  6.   see: https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL
  7. }
  8.  
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: marcov on April 06, 2020, 12:16:42 pm
Maybe also add a line referring to copying and copying.fpc "in the lazarus distribution"  or so.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: avra on April 06, 2020, 04:05:07 pm
Quote from: wp on April 06, 2020, 10:32:28 am
avra, you seem to be more experienced with licenses than I am. Is it ok when I replace the license header in the MapViewer source files by this

Quote
License: modified LGPL with linking exception (like RTL, FCL and LCL)
see: https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL

I am far from experienced, and more limited in trying to recognize what to avoid during development of closed source software then in properly understanding licenses. So, I might be more wrong then correct. Having all that in mind I will try to contribute to this discussion.

Quote from: wp on April 06, 2020, 11:11:27 am
I want to replace it by
Code: Pascal  [Select][+][-]
  1. { (c) 2014 ti_dic MapViewer component for lazarus
  2.   Parts of this component are based on :
  3.     Map Viewer Copyright (C) 2011 Maciej Kaczkowski / keit.co
  4.  
  5.   License: modified LGPL with linking exception (like RTL, FCL and LCL)
  6.   see: https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL
  7. }

I believe this would be more appropriate:
Code: Pascal  [Select][+][-]
  1. {
  2.   LazMapViewer Copyright (C) 2014 ti_dic user at Lazarus forum https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org
  3.   Map Viewer Copyright (C) 2011 Maciej Kaczkowski at https://keit.co
  4.  
  5.   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it
  6.   under the terms of the FPC modified LGPL Version 2.
  7.  
  8.   This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but WITHOUT
  9.   ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or
  10.   FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the FPC modified LGPL Version 2
  11.   license for more details.
  12.  
  13.   You should have received a copy of the FPC modified LGPL Version 2
  14.   license along with this library; if not, you can find it at this link:
  15.   https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL
  16. }

FPC modified LGPL is based on LGPL, so it should be fine to use LGPL code header template with just minor modification of replacing "LGPL" with "FPC modified LGPL Version 2", and URL address instead of Free Software Foundation US postal address. I believe that all text in LGPL code header template is there for a reason, so we should keep it as it is.

Quote from: marcov on April 06, 2020, 12:16:42 pm
Maybe also add a line referring to copying and copying.fpc "in the lazarus distribution"  or so.

Looking at \fpcsrc\rtl\COPYING.FPC all I can see is that it states what libs are covered by it, explains linking exception difference from pure LGPL, and allows anyone to "delete this exception statement from your version". So, I think we are safe to not mention link to that file. Besides, everything needed is already in the given URL.

Looking at \fpcsrc\rtl\COPYING.txt I see it's pure LGPL 2.1 license, so I think we should have such file but with the content from our license at https://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/FPC_modified_LGPL#FPC_modified_LGPL_Version_2.

LGPL recommends to "add information on how to contact you by electronic and paper mail", so if ti_dic has some better way of contacting instead of mentioning that he is a Lazarus forum user, he should step forward.

Is ti_dic the only one who should hold copyright of LazMapViewer? Original author is mentioned to hold copyright, but I do not know if other contributors besides ti_dic should be mentioned as well. I am also not sure if they should be mentioned at all.

At the end of LGPL there is a recommendation on "How to Apply These Terms to Your New Libraries" which says:
Quote
You should also get your employer (if you work as a programmer) or your
school, if any, to sign a "copyright disclaimer" for the library, if
necessary.  Here is a sample; alter the names:

  Yoyodyne, Inc., hereby disclaims all copyright interest in the
  library `Frob' (a library for tweaking knobs) written by James Random Hacker.

  <signature of Ty Coon>, 1 April 1990
  Ty Coon, President of Vice

Although this is a recommendation for new libraries, it is not clear to me if "copyright disclaimer" protects original author of the library only in a way that no contributor can claim right to original copyright, or also in a way that no additional copyright can be added to library (even forked one). It is not clear to me if additional copyright holders can be stated besides the original author.

Hopefully someone else will bring more light and correct me where I am wrong.
Title: Re: TMapViewer license change allowed by the author
Post by: wp on April 06, 2020, 07:09:43 pm
We have more than 18,000 members in this forum. Is there no lawyer among them?
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