Castle Game Engine (Cross Platform) - Need Help with Drawing a Raycast Vector

[Joanna from IRC]

In my opinion we could continue to give support, but always in the way we have done so far, the way he doesn't like and which makes him so angry.

Let’s explore this a bit further. You seem to be concerned about him being angry. I’ve often found that some pascal programmers tolerate way more abuse than they should. Like responding to trolls in such a way as well we program in pascal and people are going to insult us, that’s just how it is. Maybe if we are nice and patient to the troll he will someday like pascal...

That’s not how it works unfortunately. Trolls are like bullies that test people to see what they can get away with and it only gets worse. You had better believe they get really really angry when someone ends their fun. It’s like a spoiled child having a temper tantrum.

No! It does not have to be this way. You should not have to tolerate someone being mad at you and other emotional abuse. You and Michalias have created something nice and donated your spare time trying to help people interested in using it. People should be grateful not abusive. That is completely unacceptable!

The best way for you to help remedy this situation and any similar situations that you encounter in the future is to insist that people learn pascal so that they are able to understand what you are talking about.
In academic terms this is referred to as a prerequisite. Pascal knowledge is a prerequisite for programming with castle game engine.
This is not a new idea.

If people are too lazy to learn pascal you are better off without them honestly.

[cdbc]

Ahhh, Joanna You're so full of it...!
Give it a rest, Please!

[valter.home]

You and Michalias have created something nice

I want to clarify that I am only a CGE user 

[cpicanco]

I personally believe the TS is not a troll. If you do some research, you will know he (they) has been developing many simple games since years ago, and has asperger/austism syndrome. I heard people with such syndrome aren't good in communicating with normal person and a kind of 'stubborn'. But hey, I am not here for judging people. I only want to help others who want to learn/use Pascal and Lazarus.

Absolutely, I couldn’t agree more. It’s truly wonderful when we choose to treat each other with kindness and respect. Embracing inclusivity, especially for individuals with autism, is indeed a beautiful expression of social responsibility.

[Joanna from IRC]

You and Michalias have created something nice

I want to clarify that I am only a CGE user 

Even if you didn’t create it I read your posts in the cge forums and you definitely deserve credit for helping people use it 

especially for individuals with autism,

Actually I know someone with autism and he is on most topics very smart and has no problem at all with learning programming languages. I asked him his opinion about this thread and he is the one who gave me the help vampire link above.. I’m all for the idea of treating people with kindness and respect especially people who donate their time to make us software to use for free!

[lainz]

As I already said for me he is an experienced programmer in other languages.

A true beginner will not start with "raycast vectors", he knows stuff that's not simply understandable for the bare people.

So, again, if he points a link of CGE with an array and that array is a constant one using parentheses and he also points another site pascal documentation that parentheses are for expressions, instead of understanding ok, things are done like that. No he is trolling us saying Pascal idiom is at least rare.

When I said try with a simpler game, he refused. I can't even do that game with more than 17 years of experience programming, because I lack some other knowledge.

So this post should be closed as well, since the OP vanished. All the people wanted to help him, but he refused the help given. So I think he is a troll really.

Mental disorders are not an excuse for me, I have my own problems (that only people I want knows) and I can code as well.

[Joanna from IRC]

@lainz I’m not sure where trolls get code from but I suspect some of them try to pass off other peoples code as their own.Maybe they search the internet for it. There is also a possibility that he is making mangled code on purpose as a pretext to engage people with conversation about it. Who is to say that the extraneous begin end wasn’t put in there on purpose just to be annoying..

I’ve seen chatbots presenting code claiming it was theirs before. Not fun... time wasters  and of course there was some big stink recently about creators of ai using volunteers answering questions on stack overflow? For training purposes.

As for beginners needing complicated things it sometimes happens. I once needed help doing a complicated cte in sqlite but I certainly didn’t haunt them afterwards. Sincere people get help, say thanks and leave.

[valter.home]

A true beginner will not start with "raycast vectors", he knows stuff that's not simply understandable for the bare people.

Guys, I think you're wrong about him. You might realize this if you went to see all his posts on the CGE forum.
He didn't start from vectors, but from something much further and simpler.
He always said he knew other languages and wanted to learn Pascal because CGE is a powerful free game engine, but honestly sometimes I thought it was lacking in other languages too. After all, when you're a programmer, or something very close, it's not the language that makes the difference. You get a manual and do your own thing in the new language. If necessary, ask for help on something.
The vector problem arose from the need to visualize the raycast ray, as he couldn't make his simple code work which was supposed to make use of the raycast. I suggested he find a way to visualize the ray so he wouldn't go in blind, and @Michalis suggested two alternatives for doing so.
He probably would never have gotten lost on vectors if his piece of code had worked right away.

However, it is also true that it is currently missing.

I would also say to try waiting a few days, but then continuing to talk about it becomes useless.
He's free to do whatever he wants of course, but as I said, he needs to know that if he looks for real help he will continue to find it.

[lainz]

I did show my help. But he refused so I can't help.

I don't know CGE but I give general advice...

[Joanna from IRC]

@valter.home
People often lie and say that they are going to learn pascal {or used to use pascal and are coming back to it} because they want to give you false hope. In the rare cases where people are being truthful about learning pascal I don’t that it involves what you have experienced.

You could start by having him read the entire pascal language tutorial for castle game engine as a condition for obtaining further help. {Be sure to quiz him on it}
If he won’t he is just playing games to waste people’s time.
I know all about this type of manipulative person. No need to be an enabler for His bad behavior. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/enabler

[michalis]

People often lie and say that they are going to learn pascal {or used to use pascal and are coming back to it} because they want to give you false hope. In the rare cases where people are being truthful about learning pascal I don’t that it involves what you have experienced.

You could start by having him read the entire pascal language tutorial for castle game engine as a condition for obtaining further help. {Be sure to quiz him on it}

These claims ("people often lie...") don't match my experience at all. People are willing to learn, and pointing them to the right learning resources (good for their level of knowledge, relevant enough to the task at hand) has a positive effect in general, they follow the advise, they solve the problem, they come back with new bigger ideas. Providing good support and welcoming people (beginners included) has a positive effect.

This thread has shown how, unfortunately, trying to help the OP didn't end up in productive way. It's still not a reason for too broad claims ("people often lie..."). Or for throwing "trolls" accusations too easily -- there is a difference between "troll" who deliberately disrupts the conversation with malice and just a person with whom the conversation doesn't end in productive way. I still think OP is the case of latter (not productive), not former (troll).

For this reason, we also will not start inventing quizzes on CGE forums, or putting up any barriers for newcomers.

I am happy to help anyone to learn Castle Game Engine and/or Pascal. No matter how much you're a beginner at Castle Game Engine, or game development, or Pascal language, or programming in general, I'm happy to help. Also if you come with a knowledge of a different programming language, or different engine, and want to make comparisons -- this is also always a *plus*, I want to hear feedback and freely talk about comparisons. And listening to user feedback, including from people new to Pascal, has made CGE better.

[Joanna from IRC]

Obviously  don’t try to quiz every new person who comes there and asks a question, that would be exhausting and counterproductive. Everyone should be given the benefit of the doubt at first... It should not be hard to tell if you are having a productive conversation. If the person ignores your requests the conversation is no longer productive.

Trolls come in many forms and will adapt their techniques to what they can get away with. Obviously you probably wouldn’t allow him to spam your forums with pornography links so he is using the help vampire strategy instead to sabotage your community. It appears to be working quite well at wasting your time and frustrating you.
Counterproductive is a very nice way of saying it.. If it were me I would say that I got owned by a troll.

I’m only offering you advice because I want to help your community not get sabotaged. I have had to learn the hard way about trolls so I’m trying to pass my knowledge along to you to save you from having A similar experience.

I think you underestimate trolls. Yes it’s possible for a skilled troll/s to transform a vibrant happy community into a screaming angry mess and then a dead zone. I’ve seen it happen on more than one occasion.

There is one thing about this that bothers me though... I’m starting to feel like I’ve spent a lot of time trying to help you but we are not making any progress. I guess you will learn eventually, hopefully with your community still intact. As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.

[lainz]

This should be closed, it does offtopic at the end.

I he was or not a troll doesn't matter. The damage is done to the forum.

[Joanna from IRC]

I agree.
I hope my advice was helpful even if the people having difficulty with the troll don’t heed it. 

[valter.home]

I think you underestimate trolls. Yes it’s possible for a skilled troll/s to transform a vibrant happy community into a screaming angry mess and then a dead zone. I’ve seen it happen on more than one occasion.

Despite my previous words, I must admit that I too have experienced firsthand the death of a large Delphi community, with great gurus willing to help, and many many people of all levels. An inexhaustible source of information for everyone, from beginners on up. But after the passage of a Troll, a real Troll, it was the end.

Almost all the posts ended with heated discussions among the participants, people who had never raised their voices until before his arrival. Each of them wanted to be right.

People started leaving the forum, until he was completely dead.

Now I ask myself a question. Why doesn't the OP intervene? I'm sure he continues to read us. What would he be thinking? Was he offended by what we said or was there another reason?

I agree with what has just been said, close this thread now with a nice padlock and let's not think about it anymore. This thread is of no use and is in danger of ending as stated above: he's a troll... no he's not... stop talking nonsense... is a person with health problems... and so on... Dangerous discussions arise this way and this is not the purpose of the forum.

If the OP wants, he'll open another one.