LazPaint (alpha-blending, antialiasing, filters)

[howardpc]

A factor to bear in mind is that not all ISPs support newsgroups. For instance my ISP (talktalk.co.uk) does not, though I don't know how common this is internationally.

[circular]

Oh ok so what is more is that message have a tree structure, isn't it?

[Mike.Cornflake]

A factor to bear in mind is that not all ISPs support newsgroups. For instance my ISP (talktalk.co.uk) does not, though I don't know how common this is internationally.

Isn't this only an issue if you're using your ISPs newsgroup server?   In this case Graeme is offering use of his server...

[taazz]

A factor to bear in mind is that not all ISPs support newsgroups. For instance my ISP (talktalk.co.uk) does not, though I don't know how common this is internationally.

My experience so far is that no isp is offering usenet access any more, and even if they do they do on a very limited set that might or might not include the comp.* tree.

Isn't this only an issue if you're using your ISPs newsgroup server?   In this case Graeme is offering use of his server...

Consider usenet something like the internet it self there are a number of nntp servers out there that each one mirrors and is been mirrored by the others you connecto to eg news.YourISP.com and subscribe to comp.algorithms.graphics.2DVectors which is host from an obscure server in australia but its mirrored by your ISP's news server for you and here start all the problems not all isps mirror everything and not everything that is mirrored is available to free users and on top of that they retain the message for a limited time something like 2 hours depending on the traffic size of the messages etc if you do not get the new messages inside that time frame you lost them, etc.
So if your ISP is not offering any news mirroring you have no usenet access but you still can access individual server if you know their address, something like the internet with out google or any search engine. Ruffly that is the situation.

[taazz]

Oh ok so what is more is that message have a tree structure, isn't it?

no what is more is that the message are located on your computer you can have a backlog as big as you like keeping the most interesting discussions for you and even if tomorrow the 3rd world war collapses the internet infrastructure you do not loose access to your information and yes the tree structure is a nice thing to have too.

[Graeme]

How different is a newsgroup server from a forum?

Wow, I must be showing my age then. :-)

• NNTP was designed from the ground up for group communications - that is what it does really well
• It's efficient and fast
• Works online and offline (depending on your NNTP client - news reader)
• Each user can decide what news client/reader to use, and not be forced to use different forums software on each forum - all have different logins functionality, limitations etc
• Its dead simple to migrate existing news articles to new server software if the need ever arises (thus portable)
• By default articles are listed in a tree-like structure in news clients, so it is very easy to follow a discussion
• Some news clients (eg: XanaNews) have advanced features like ignoring messages from certain people, rating articles, auto highlight topics you might find interesting etc.
• Login/Authentication can be setup. eg: you can have anonymous read access, but if you want to post, you need a username/password. Luckily most news servers don't required annoying username/passwords - this is how I run my server.

I'm sure if you spend 10 minutes on Google you will find many more reasons as to what makes NNTP good.

[Graeme]

A factor to bear in mind is that not all ISPs support newsgroups. For instance my ISP (talktalk.co.uk) does not, though I don't know how common this is internationally.

I fail to understand what you mean? Can't you access existing NNTP news servers? I'm not talking about the 10,000+ USENET groups, I'm talking about any NNTP server (eg: try and access my server - details below). I can't imagine any ISP blocks such traffic - what would be their reasoning to do that?

Or do you mean you can't host a NNTP server?  That might be the case, but you can configure a NNTP Server to listen on a non-standard port, thus easily overcoming the ISP restriction.

To test your setup, why don't you download Mozilla Thunderbird or XanaNews or Pan etc... any news client and try and access my server.
  Server name:   opensoft.homeip.net
                           ...alternatively...
                        geldenhuys.co.uk
  Port: 119

[lainz]

Why are ALL conversations about LazPaint done in this single message thread!?  It makes it impossible to find a specific topic, follow a discussion etc.

I think it comes from the time when LazPaint did not have his own subforum. In Third Party forum..

IMHO is a good idea to separate in different threads / subforum like: bug report, suggestions, patches, releases...

Maybe circular needs to be moderator in this forum?

Using a newsgroup maybe it's ok, I don't know how much people will read the newsgroup vs read the forum (for example I will keep just reading the forum) just because I'm used to using forums, nothing more.

[CM630]

Using a newsgroup maybe it's ok, I don't know how much people will read the newsgroup vs read the forum (for example I will keep just reading the forum) just because I'm used to using forums, nothing more.

Exactly.
Besides using a less known form of communication would repel users and hinder feedback.


 

Why are ALL conversations about LazPaint done in this single message thread!?  It makes it impossible to find a specific topic, follow a discussion etc.

You are generally right, but as you see, you yourself did not start a separate thread for this question.

[Graeme]

I think it comes from the time when LazPaint did not have his own subforum. In Third Party forum..

That could explain it, but that isn't the case any more, yet everybody still keeps posting to this single thread - like we are doing now. :-) Yet more variation of discussions - all under one topic.

Using a newsgroup maybe it's ok, I don't know how much people will read the newsgroup vs read the forum (for example I will keep just reading the forum) just because I'm used to using forums, nothing more.

Don't you read emails? Don't you use mailing lists? If you do, you could use a Mail/News client combined - like Mozilla Thunderbird. All electronic communications in one applications. That's convenient.

Either way, I don't care to much. I just thought it wasn't the best idea to throw every topic under the sun, and the kitchen sink under a  single LazPaint (alpha-blending, antialiasing, filters) topic. That doesn't make sense to me.

[Graeme]

Besides using a less known form of communication would repel users and hinder feedback.

NNTP has a much longer history than web forums, and I have to disagree with your statement. The fpGUI, tiOPF, Embarcadero, OpenWatcom compiler and many other popular open source projects use NNTP to discuss development and support. They are all active and doing just fine.

And if you really like a web browser that much, simply use a web frontend to read NNTP news. I supply that on my server, and Embarcadero has done the same on theirs.

[lainz]

I think the only way to ensure it will work is setting the server and start using it.

[circular]

Thank you for all these information and debate. Yes 007, we can try and see.

I definitely think the web interface is adequate to smooth the transition with the forum. Then we will have to think about where to put the links towards this web interface. I would think it is safer to have a login system in the web interface.

[circular]

Maybe circular needs to be moderator in this forum?

I could reorganise some stuff, yes.

Using a newsgroup maybe it's ok, I don't know how much people will read the newsgroup vs read the forum (for example I will keep just reading the forum) just because I'm used to using forums, nothing more.

I will still post about last changes on the monster thread, so if you are interested by one, you could then go in the newsgroup or not. If there is a web interface, I may even put direct links to the pages, that would be accessible without login as readonly.

[lainz]

Check this
http://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,25843.msg157663/topicseen.html