I do not hate nor think Delphi is bad.Yes... Delphi isn't bad !
Qt and Delphi are alike, this way. All we can do is run away and wait for their final fallMaybe, but Qt and KDE made an arrangement so that Qt could be used freely in the Linux/UNIX world. If Qt were to change that it would be the end of the KDE desktop.
Qt and Delphi are alike, this way. All we can do is run away and wait for their final fallMaybe, but Qt and KDE made an arrangement so that Qt could be used freely in the Linux/UNIX world. If Qt were to change that it would be the end of the KDE desktop.
true until Qt 4.5, false with Qt 5.xx and below. interea, digia bought Qt from nokiaNot sure about that. On KDE.org we read: "The KDE Free Qt Foundation is an organization with the purpose of securing the availability of the Qt toolkit."
that is why i am moving some of my works from Qt to Ultimate ++
https://www.ultimatepp.org/www$uppweb$vsqt$en-us.html (https://www.ultimatepp.org/www$uppweb$vsqt$en-us.html)
true until Qt 4.5, false with Qt 5.xx and below. interea, digia bought Qt from nokiaNot sure about that. On KDE.org we read: "The KDE Free Qt Foundation is an organization with the purpose of securing the availability of the Qt toolkit."
that is why i am moving some of my works from Qt to Ultimate ++
https://www.ultimatepp.org/www$uppweb$vsqt$en-us.html (https://www.ultimatepp.org/www$uppweb$vsqt$en-us.html)
And regarding history: "In September 2012, Digia bought Qt from Nokia and signed a letter of commitment to be bound by any and all terms of agreement, and then continued to sign a revised agreement with the foundation. Later Digia founded The Qt Company, which signed a similar letter of commitment and negotiated an update to the agreement."
Perhaps somewhere in the future a transition will be made by the KDE team to move on to U++, but for now, KDE seems perfectly comfortable with Digia's commitment.
I am on the neutral side. I do not hate nor think Delphi is bad. Yes, I'm sad that I'm not listed in their target customer range, but that doesn't mean I should blame them. Everyone has their business strategy and target customers. I want to buy iMac but cannot afford it, should I blame Apple that set the price too high?If you read my text carefully, actually there's nobody hates or blames anybody or anything. I'm just trying to put everything in its own place and context. Delphi as a product is actually a good product, we –Pascal programmers– owe many modern Pascal features to Delphi. If you can afford it, it could be the best development tool for you. However, if you can't afford it or you're not in its target market, you should not complaining and whining over Embarcadero business strategy. You should look for another alternative which it could be Lazarus IDE (with FPC) or another language. Especially for teachers, don't let yourself and your pupils to be depended upon commercial and proprietary product such as Delphi while there are many equal or better alternatives.
I had been away from professional programming jobs for some months (last time played with VS), and now someone pull me back to Windows programming again with the setup above. I think I can go quite far with it.Indeed. Delphi's strongest advantage is Windows desktop application programming. However it's now a stagnant market. Every app today goes to the web and/or mobile. And the free version of Delphi doesn't provide that.
I'd consider web programming in the future with Delphi Tokyo Starter + UniGUI. They work together well in my experiments.Yes, web programming with Delphi is the future. I've heard that since like over 10 years ago. :D
I believe you when you say that web programming had been done with FPC long time ago. Years ago I had seen your work using ExtPascal too.It seems you've been with this community for quite a while, though your posting count doesn't really reflect that. You know… ExtPascal is like ages ago. I haven't used it anymore, that's why I left the project.
I am aware of the options you mentioned. But I'm afraid that none of them have the conveniences UniGUI offers; that you don't have to deal with low level intricacies of web programming. And you create applications in the same way like the good old Delphi. It is like I've gotten used to using washing machine, I don't want to wash clothes manually again :DI used to think like that. It's also the reason I joined the ExtPascal project. Until the smartphones came along, especially since the iPhone rising, I found that such UI paradigm (desktop-like interface) doesn't work on mobile devices.
Well... who knows Farshad is reading and turn this into reality :DWell… everybody may a have a dream. Good luck! :D
I started to make small side projects in FP, but I still can't port my main project to FP+Lazarus, cuz FP is still isn't fully Delphi2009-compatible. It has taken too much time to migrate to using new powerful features, like generics and anonymous methods, so I just can't degrade back to Delphi 7 era again.It goes both ways actually. Delphi has something FPC doesn't have, as FPC also has something Delphi doesn't have. For example, I've been wanting Linux support from Delphi since 2007, just to be fulfilled at 2017. It's now too late to convert tens of my web apps already running well on my Linux servers, since 2007. Plus thousands of dollar I have to pay for Delphi. As I've said, nothing is perfect. And our miles may vary.
I started to make small side projects in FP, but I still can't port my main project to FP+Lazarus, cuz FP is still isn't fully Delphi2009-compatible. It has taken too much time to migrate to using new powerful features, like generics and anonymous methods, so I just can't degrade back to Delphi 7 era again.
One thing about open source project, especially voluntary-based open source project, and in particular FPC project… you can't just request for something and the developers will just provide it for you right away. No, FPC project doesn't work that way. If you need a feature –or a bug to be fixed– and nobody does it for you, for whatever reasons, then you gotta do it by yourself, or hire someone to do it for you. Unlike Delphi, you have all the FPC's source codes and the right to modify it for your own purpose. That can be good or bad, depends on how you look at it.I guess, biggest problem - is so called "variable capture". It needs complete overhaul of variable handling code. I really tried to do it myself, but FPC's code is too messy and it's really hard to understand, how to implement anything without some help. When I asked for help, nobody helped me.
3.0 generics are better than D2009-DXE level. While doing some projects with lazarus I used 3.0 with an older version of the generics libs now merged into trunk quite happily. I don't use anonymous methods though, also not in Delphi (at home D2009, at work DXE10).I don't know, I have problems with code, like this one:
While in Delphi this code works perfectly:What are you smoking? >:D >:D >:D
What are you smoking? >:D >:D >:DHe's smoking FPC 3.0.0 or FPC 3.0.2 or FPC 3.0.4 .
Simply compiles....Yes, with FPC trunk it does compile.
P.s. did you guys also get a special offer this week from Idera? I could /upgrade/ (from XE7) to the latest and greatest delphi pro for the diminutive sum of Eur 1200, which already included a 30% discount.
What are you smoking? >:D >:D >:DI know about Delphi mode, but he said, that FPC generics are somehow better, than Delphi ones.
Simply compiles....
He's smoking FPC 3.0.0 or FPC 3.0.2 or FPC 3.0.4 .Yeah, still "Syntax error", even in Delphi mode. FPC 3.0.2.
I know about Delphi mode, but he said, that FPC generics are somehow better, than Delphi ones.
Wow… guys, c'mon… if you're gonna talk about the technical details of FPC vs Delphi, please get a room for yourself. This thread is about why we should avoid Delphi and go for FPC and LazIDE in general and non-technical term, especially for educations, newbies, hobbyists, and indie/startup developers.
and this is not only in africa! i knew a nice gurl from a romanian university, with a skill at computer sciences LOOOOLAre you gender-bashing there ? If it is then i would say: typical. I will pray for you if you ever meet real girl-power (i've chosen "if" for a particular reason, because males often have the illusion it is their choice) :)
you should try to not be OFF topic as you often are on this forum...This message is just here to remind you of your own off-topic words, to which i replied. You are for sure a real gentlemen with your choice of words *barf*.
@molly shud up barker, i married that gurl, find a sheep and a life, poor idiot of nonsense
you should try to not be OFF topic as you often are on this forum, poor minded donkey u HAHAHHAHAH
dear fuckedup @molly
until you came and troll, I was not OFF topic, and only refering to the post subject, that is, the aggressive politic policy price of Delphi against the Lazarus free model.
Worldwide unaffordable Delphi
there you came! with yer gender reverse engineering HAHAHAHAHAH
huh... even if at least, civilization ran a way 15000 years long, telling and yelling <all Great Ancestors were so damn wrong about gendernisalazation! HERE COMES the "L"ight with molly> on a ...... what the heck??? a programmers forum? SUCH A RIGHT PLACE HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHA MORON U
Catch a Doctor or a dedicated forum for your sexual issues HAHAHAHAH, defunnytalately NOT ME :D :D :D
Delphi's pricing and business model are obviously NOT for students and teachers, hobbyist, nor indie developers.
If I were a professional developer, I would scrape together the money to get Delphi as soon as I could, and just use FPC/Lazarus to port - though I'd likely just ignore anything but Windows/MacOS since the others are irrelevant when it comes to developing end-user software for the consumer market.oddly, I'm starting to earn $$ creating software for Unix based OS thanks to an upsurge of single board computers. 8)
I think Lazarus is severely lacking in polish.
Developing end user software for the consumer market? That was the primary scenario for which delphi was used when it was cheap.If I were a professional developer, I would scrape together the money to get Delphi as soon as I could, and just use FPC/Lazarus to port - though I'd likely just ignore anything but Windows/MacOS since the others are irrelevant when it comes to developing end-user software for the consumer market.oddly, I'm starting to earn $$ creating software for Unix based OS thanks to an upsurge of single board computers. 8)
The experience is pretty good when you have used no decent commercial delphi ide since 1996. That's not really saying much...QuoteI think Lazarus is severely lacking in polish.
Well, I went from Turbo Pascal to Delphi 1 and 2 then moved away. My return, via Lazarus is pretty good experience indeed ! I have not seen a recent Delphi so cannot comment. But Lazarus does the job for me now and would have been fine way back then.
As for Embarcadero policies, its a pretty normal business model for people who buy and sell going businesses. If you buy a business thats doing well, you coast from there spending the absolute minimum to keep people on track. And you run it down making a good profit while you do so.
Then, someone else buys it, they put a lot of work in attracting new customers, build it up and hopefully sell it to someone else. And the cycle continues.
Embarcadero has no incentive to attract new users offering deals for hobby and small scale users, they don't pay short term.
Davo
I use both MacOS and Windows. Lazarus and the apps it generated (I'm assuming they use GTK or Qt) do not look native on either platform.AFAIK, Lazarus is able to use many UI widgetsets –including but not limited to gtk and qt-- on many platforms. But, by default it's using the native widgetset on each platform which means gdi+ on Windows, carbon or cocoa on Mac, gtk or qt on Linux. Well, of course you may also use qt on Windows or Mac since qt also works on on many platforms as well (if it's already installed).
Parts of the UI render badly in Windows as a result.I believe it's still using native widgetset on Windows (gdi+) but poorly set and configured, unless if you compile Lazarus using different widgetset (qt?). That's one of many problems with cross platform UI programming. Managing cross platform look-and-feel is not easy even when using the native widgetset, because all little details matters, such as button size, button position, widget behaviour, component margins, default menu items, etc.
And if someone really wants the same appearance on each platform then I think it's easy to achieve: Use a bsNone-Window and do/paint everything yourself. Then it should look the same I guess... Haven't tried this on a Mac or on Linux though... :)To have cross-platform GUI framework, written on Pascal from scratch, using VCL/LCL - is actually my dream. Just because every OS has it's own GUI framework, written from scratch, but using it's own graphics library, that all have very similar functionality, such as "Draw line, draw circle, draw rect, draw text and draw bitmap". Yeah, inviting a bicycle - is bad thing, but such framework would have better performance and better compatibility.
And if someone really wants the same appearance on each platform then I think it's easy to achieve: Use a bsNone-Window and do/paint everything yourself. Then it should look the same I guess... Haven't tried this on a Mac or on Linux though... :)Someone is usually the programmer.... NOT the user..... That is the point.....
.....but in the ORIGINAL Mario you could cheat by jumping off screen.... And you can't with any other version....Probably a feature ... :P
8-) O:-)Quote.....but in the ORIGINAL Mario you could cheat by jumping off screen.... And you can't with any other version....Probably a feature ... :P
I don't know if new members for forum is any guide but there has been a bit of a reduction over time.
With nothing new I wouldn't expect spikes any time soon.Not so. The coming 1.8 release will make all charts sky-rocket again. :)
With nothing new I wouldn't expect spikes any time soon.Not so. The coming 1.8 release will make all charts sky-rocket again. :)
I think the decline of Delphi has negative impact for Lazarus/FPC too. Also the rise of mobile programming.100%
Maybe with this, there is a little chance for comeback for Pascal.
I installed Delphi XE2 (architect) and i noticed inside it, parts of fpk source code for iOS and android. That brought me a little reflexion. If the 'template" (delphi') of lazarus took its cousin (lazarus) as template 2 years ago, there is a sort of "snake biting its tail' concept precluding any noticeable evolution in language and features!
before it had its own platform compilers.
Unless –of course– if you don't mind to spend some great amount of your (company) money, you may use Delphi happily.I outright refuse to use any "ransom ware". You can't buy Delphi any more, you can only rent it. Just imagine... Your run your own one-man business. One year is a lot tougher than the previous, so your income is very low. Your Delphi subscription runs out, you don't have the money to renew - POOF, your development tools stop working. Until you pay the ransom, then magically it starts working again. That's definitely not how I want to run my business.
Oh… and please stop praising Delphi as the best tool ever. It's non-sense. Well, it used to be, but it's no longer now. Today there are many dev tools out there that are as good as Delphi or even better.Hell, Lazarus IDE is much better than Delphi IDE these days. Delphi IDE is so buggy and tons of things almost work, but never really get fixed. I recently did a contracting job and had to use Delphi again. In the first week I found so many bugs and reported all of them. They were confirmed by the community and most bugs have been in Delphi IDE for over 6 years - and still not fixed. EMBT doesn't care. They get their monthly subscription fees if they do work or not.