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Author Topic: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java  (Read 14651 times)

Lord_ZealoN

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Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« on: August 10, 2009, 09:42:48 am »
Hi all,

I need to give a report to my boss, about develping our projects in one of this 2 enviroments.

He heard about Java, but not Delphi, for this reason, I need to give him this report.

I ask for help to get a list of advantages, and disadvantages of using Lazarus/FPC instead NetBeans/Java.

Cheers.

LazaruX

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2009, 11:28:02 am »
Intresting thing that Netbenans.

The only thing I can tell you, is that Lazarus/FPC supports more toolkits. Netbeans only QT. Laz/FPC supports also GTK and GTK2

theo

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2009, 11:57:48 am »
The only thing I can tell you, is that Lazarus/FPC supports more toolkits. Netbeans only QT.

How does Netbeans support Qt?

I ask for help to get a list of advantages, and disadvantages of using Lazarus/FPC instead NetBeans/Java.

It probably depends for what you want to use it.

Lord_ZealoN

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2009, 12:06:14 pm »
The only thing I can tell you, is that Lazarus/FPC supports more toolkits. Netbeans only QT.

How does Netbeans support Qt?

http://doc.trolltech.com/qtjambi-4.4/html/com/trolltech/qt/qtjambi-index.html

Quote
I ask for help to get a list of advantages, and disadvantages of using Lazarus/FPC instead NetBeans/Java.

It probably depends for what you want to use it.

Well. Web Development, software for internal use and multi purppose soft to sell. There are various projects in the air.

I don't like Java, but, I must admit, is more "famous", and easy to find developers, libs, and so on.

As always, the team who develops, is not the team who choose. I alwas say..

The power of decision is inversely proportional to the knowledge.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 12:46:16 pm by Lord_ZealoN »

cyber_python

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2009, 12:15:53 pm »
Intresting thing that Netbenans.

The only thing I can tell you, is that Lazarus/FPC supports more toolkits. Netbeans only QT. Laz/FPC supports also GTK and GTK2

Netbeans supports (and uses) only the Swing toolkit (that is part of the standard JRE).
Also, SWT is another option available to Java developers using Eclipse.

Through java bindings one can use other toolkits such as QT (via Jambi), or GTK+ (java-gnome 4.0) but they would have to create the GUI through code (or toolkit-specific external tools e.g. Glade).

Troodon

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2009, 03:04:55 pm »
The choice should probably depend mostly on which libraries the developers are familiar with. That being said, I believe a compiled executable (Lazarus/FPC) is always better that an interpreted one (Java).
Lazarus/FPC on Linux

Phil

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2009, 07:19:45 pm »
Well. Web Development, software for internal use and multi purppose soft to sell. There are various projects in the air.

For Web development with Pascal, be sure to review ExtPascal:

http://code.google.com/p/extpascal/

You can use Delphi or Free Pascal and deploy to any platform. At its heart is the slick Ext JS components set.

Thanks.

-Phil

touchring

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2009, 06:58:26 am »
Intresting thing that Netbenans.

The only thing I can tell you, is that Lazarus/FPC supports more toolkits. Netbeans only QT. Laz/FPC supports also GTK and GTK2

Netbeans supports (and uses) only the Swing toolkit (that is part of the standard JRE).
Also, SWT is another option available to Java developers using Eclipse.

Through java bindings one can use other toolkits such as QT (via Jambi), or GTK+ (java-gnome 4.0) but they would have to create the GUI through code (or toolkit-specific external tools e.g. Glade).


Java/netbeans is many times more difficult to learn than pascal/delphi/lazarus, formal training is required.

I've managed some Java projects, including one that installed netbean/eclipse, never figured out how it works on my own, even for installing, had to rely on step by step instructions from my programmer - and i don't like it.   :D

From the programmer point of view, Java is good because you have to rely on the programmer from installation to development to maintenance.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 07:06:07 am by touchring »

osvaldo-tcf

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2009, 02:15:51 pm »
Modern work is made with OOP: OPF, Pattern, etc.

Java is rich of solutions in this area. Several frameworks help production team.

Try Lazarus from subversion with FPC 2.2.4 and this project:

www.pressobjects.org

Graeme

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2009, 07:45:13 pm »
I ask for help to get a list of advantages, and disadvantages of using Lazarus/FPC instead NetBeans/Java.

I had to do the same excersize 4 years ago. I got a list of our project requirements, what existing code we have that we would like to reuse if possible, and what languages our developers know. Our project were going to start off for the Linux and Windows platform and then later branch into Mac and FreeBSD support as well.

Your project requirements are very important. Things to take into account.
  - Available GUI toolkits for the language
  - What reporting sollutions are available
  - What backend database do you want to talk to
  - Do you need to use 3rd party component to talk to databases
  - How reliable is the language vendor. Will they still exist in 5 or 10 years.
  - How easy is application deployment
  - etc...

This narrowed down our search. Nobody liked C/C++, plus the Qt toolkit was too expensive. Kylix was unsupported, Delphi's future was uncertain, Microsoft's .NET was not cross platform, Mono was still in early development stages plus it has some licensing doubts hanging over it.

Luckily I stumbled across Free Pascal and Lazarus. We had existing projects in Visual Basic 6 and Delphi 5. Most of our developers were trained in both, but due to VB6 language being a total rewrite for .NET, that was also not an option for us. So that left Java and Object Pascal.

We liked the idea that we could reused some of our Delphi code for new projects. We would get up to speed much quicker because our developers are already familiar with the Object Pascal language.

Free Pascal and Lazarus was our ideal candidate that fit all our requirements. Also because it's open source, we know the development tools will continue improving, and we can maintain parts of it or submit fixes. True native applications are also much easier to deploy with no runtime requirements. So to make a long story short, we ended up using Free Pascal and Lazarus IDE. We have not regretted our decision to this day. We did end up writing our own custom drawn GUI Toolkit (called fpGUI) to fullfil some of our more specific requirements which the Lazarus LCL was not going too.

You did raise a valid point though that there are a lot more Java developers out there, but Object Pascal is such a easy and clean language. Any experienced developer, no matter what language they used, will find it easy to learn.

In the end, we are perfectly happy with the choice we made. We use the following tools for all our development work.

 - Free Pascal compiler
 - Lazarus IDE (not the LCL)
 - tiOPF as our persistence framework to talk to any backend database
 - tiOPF also includes Model-GUI-Mediator implementation, so we can use
   standard non-db GUI components to bind to our business objects.
 - SqlDB database components that come included with FPC and tiOPF supports.
 - We used to use FPCUnit for unit testing, but recently ported and switched to DUnit2
 - fpGUI Toolkit as our GUI toolkit
 - tiRTFReport (included with tiOPF) which generates RTF files for reporting. We then
   use OpenOffice to create the report templates and for viewing reports.
 
Sorry for the loooong reply, but I hope this gives your some pointers and things to look out for. You might have noticed that all our development tools are open source. This cut our development costs a lot, no matter how many developers we employ - plus we can always stay current with the latest and greatest versions of all the tools.

« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 07:48:17 pm by graemeg »
--
fpGUI Toolkit - a cross-platform GUI toolkit using Free Pascal
http://fpgui.sourceforge.net/

Lord_ZealoN

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Re: Lazarus/FPC vs Netbeans/Java
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2009, 01:01:47 pm »
Thanks Graeme and the rest for yours comments 8)

 

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