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Author Topic: Shoud I update manually installed debs?  (Read 2004 times)

stem

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Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« on: November 02, 2018, 05:39:03 pm »
Hi,

my system: Ubuntu 18.04 (x86_64).

This afternoon I've downloaded the latest deb files from the Lazarus homepage and installed them. Everything works fine!

Now the update management ("Aktualisierungsverwaltung" in German) recommends me to update "fpc":
Old version: 3.0.4
New version: 3.0.4+dfsg-18ubuntu2
Size: 23 kB

Should I install this new version?

Can I tell Linux that I don't want to be informed about new updates to fpc, fpc-src and Lazarus?

What would you recommend?

Thank you!


stem

Thaddy

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2018, 06:04:49 pm »
This is the same as you get with
Code: Bash  [Select]
  1. sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade
so there are no issues to update.
You can verify it by doing the above: it is the Ubuntu package management that attents you.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 06:06:49 pm by Thaddy »
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stem

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2018, 06:26:05 pm »
apt tells me the same:

Code: Bash  [Select]
  1. apt list --upgradable -a
  2. Auflistung... Fertig
  3. fpc/bionic-updates,bionic-updates 3.0.4+dfsg-18ubuntu2 amd64 [aktualisierbar von: 3.0.4]
  4. fpc/bionic,bionic 3.0.4+dfsg-18 amd64
  5. fpc/now 3.0.4 amd64  [Installiert,aktualisierbar auf: 3.0.4+dfsg-18ubuntu2]

lucamar

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2018, 06:33:59 pm »
Do note that there may be some problems. Search the forum and you'll see lots of posts like those two.

If you're used to install from the official DEBs I would recommend to ignore system-proposed updates.
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Thaddy

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2018, 07:08:41 pm »
Those mostly are caused by mixing installs from e.g. FPC itself and Ubuntu provided updates.
If your install on Ubuntu works, it is safe to update because it passed all tests against the previous version provided by Ubuntu.
If you mix it with other debs, like the fpc provided ones, you may have those issues, yes.

If you want to make sure, pin it first. See https://wiki.debian.org/RollbackUpdate
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Hartmut

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2018, 07:10:31 pm »
@stem:
I had the same situation as you and lost my complete Lazarus installation during the update of "fpc" (see https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,42393.0.html).

My solution was to lock "fpc" and "fpc-src" via Synaptic package manager (if you have GNOME desktop) or via Muon package manager (if you have KDE-plasma desktop).

For the future I would use and recommend fpcupdeluxe to install Lazarus+FPC (see http://wiki.freepascal.org/fpcupdeluxe and http://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,34645.0.html).

Handoko

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2018, 07:25:36 pm »
+1 Hartmut

I think we should also mentioned JuhaManninen's suggestion: don't use deb packages but get the source and manually compile your Lazarus.

Thaddy

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2018, 07:35:25 pm »
+1 Hartmut

I think we should also mentioned JuhaManninen's suggestion: don't use deb packages but get the source and manually compile your Lazarus.
- Since I am an Ubuntu user and  *never* ran into your problems that is a bit of nonsense. Unable to reproduce. Maybe I have the required discipline after all  8-)
- What I can reproduce is people who mix official Ubuntu provided debs with also official fpc debs or there own builds to the same location!. These are not synced. Of the two, one is a rogue package builder and communication between the two seems missing.
- Compiling from source is recommended indeed, but not when you want a complete uninstall. The official Ubuntu debs can do uninstall and purge.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 07:37:01 pm by Thaddy »
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Handoko

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2018, 09:05:07 pm »
- What I can reproduce is people who mix official Ubuntu provided debs with also official fpc debs or there own builds to the same location!

That's a good point.
The problem happens if we're trying to mix them (Lazarus from SourceForge + FPC from Ubuntu).

I reread the title of this thread:

Quote
Shoud I update manually installed debs?

Manually ... it's mean not from Ubuntu. So the short answer for the TS is: no, don't do it.

- Since I am an Ubuntu user and  *never* ran into your problems that is a bit of nonsense. Unable to reproduce. Maybe I have the required discipline after all  8-)

Of course you didn't and you should not, you're a well-experienced both user and programmer. Even if something bad really happens, you can solve it in the blink of an eye. ;)

Off topic
I noticed you changed your avatar, it's too eye-catching. I wonder what it is. A map, a croissant, a cloud? I checked the Internet but even Google Image Search failed to give me the answer.

VTwin

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2018, 01:04:28 am »
I've been using the official Linux deb install from SourceForge. The Ubuntu version of Lazarus always seems outdated. I'm a bit conservative since I have three machines to keep coordinated, so only use svn on one machine to keep up with Cocoa updates.

Maybe this is bad, but I can't keep up with all updates on all platforms on three machines.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2018, 01:32:17 am by VTwin »
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VTwin

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2018, 01:10:23 am »
Off topic
I noticed you changed your avatar, it's too eye-catching. I wonder what it is. A map, a croissant, a cloud? I checked the Internet but even Google Image Search failed to give me the answer.

 :D
“Talk is cheap. Show me the code.” Linus Torvalds

Lazarus 2.0.0RC3 svn 6006: macOS 10.11.6 (64 bit Cocoa)
Lazarus 1.8.4: Win 7 (64 bit) & Ubuntu 16.04.3 (64 bit) on VBox

lucamar

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2018, 01:28:45 am »
- What I can reproduce is people who mix official Ubuntu provided debs with also official fpc debs or there own builds to the same location!. These are not synced. Of the two, one is a rogue package builder and communication between the two seems missing.

Do note that it seems to be the OP situation:
This afternoon I've downloaded the latest deb files from the Lazarus homepage and installed them. Everything works fine!

Now the update management ("Aktualisierungsverwaltung" in German) recommends me to update "fpc":
Old version: 3.0.4
New version: 3.0.4+dfsg-18ubuntu2
Size: 23 kB

I.e. installed packages from Lazarus/FPC (sourceforge?) and Ubuntu wants to "update" them with their own.

For completeness sake, I must say that I've always installed from official Lazarus (vs. Ubuntu) DEBs and never had a problem either. But then, the OS has never asked me to "update" them. Hence my pointing to other people who seems to have had them (problems, that is).
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dbannon

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2018, 06:37:11 am »
I note that in the Lazarus 2 install kits, fpc seems to have been renamed fpc-laz, I suggest thats to avoid just this situation. ie, we install the sourceforge fpc, apt sees it and wants to 'upgrade' it to its idea of what we should be using. From memory, it was quite insistent too.

My advice is a very casual user who just wants to have a little play should stick with the Ubuntu packages, mainly because its very easy.  Anyone who is even a bit more serious really needs to take charge of their own machine and manually install. Given Martin_Fr recent suggestion that Lazarus 2 might be built with fpc 3.2, especially so. My guess is if you put a sourceforge deb of 3.2 on now, Ubuntu will want to 'upgrade' it to 1.8.4 and in a release or two, maybe the reverse !

Manual install is easy and probably means packages from sourceforge  but I prefer to build Lazarus from source rather than have it all end up read only.
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stem

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Re: Shoud I update manually installed debs?
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2018, 08:51:23 am »
Hi,

thank you for your answers. Now I've blocked the three packages "fpc", "fpc-src" and "lazarus-project" both in Synaptic and in the Ubuntu update management.


stem