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Author Topic: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12  (Read 7404 times)

GillesH

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lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« on: June 21, 2017, 05:12:55 pm »
Hello,

How to install lazvcl-1.0 properly on a configuration macOS 10.12 – Lazarus 1.6.4 – fpc 3.0.2 ?

Where do you get the two libraries needed libvlc.dylib and libvlccore.dylib (compatible with Lazarus so 32 bits) ?
Thanks. Gilles

GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2017, 08:27:49 am »
Hello,

No one uses this librairies ? Concretely (economically), this means that I will have to lose a day or two to test the various approaches more or less recent and updated...after losing 2 days to install gdb to use it with Lazarus.

By losing a very unproductive time in a professional environment, I wonder
  • am I sure that Lazarus is economically accounting for development in enterprise whose profession is the programming for Desktop multi OS projects ?
  • is it really usable - I mean professional used - with MacOS X.12

How can we accept losing so much time at each development ?

I often criticize Delphi but there, even offering to pay to have additional components (because more profitable), I can not find the least correspondent or get the information sought.

I laugh at the gratuitousness ... but I am looking for services. It's even my dispute with Delphi. We can not wait 6 months to fix a bug that paralyzes the progress of our projects.

I ask for it publicly since I tried in vain by private mail to contact 2 different members of the team Lazarus: Would it not be possible, as is the case on other development platforms, to set up a contractual service to provide assistance and support for business development.

If it is not, it is enough to say it. More than a year ago, a private response was "We are thinking about it. A meeting is planned". One year is very long in a development cycle.

We are working on 3 desktop (Windows, Linux and Mac OS, 32 and 64 bits). Our main development tool is Qt and it will remain so. But tactically, we need a second second platform. Lazarus can be. But recently, the possibility Delphi Linux Desktop has appeared.

But in both cases, the problem is not the potential but the critical time management of our developments :  this target time is a determining factor of cost. Mastering management means controlling time.

In short, we do not know if Lazarus (and his team) can meet our expectations. We know the technical capabilities of Lazarus fpc, its strengths and weaknesses. But it is the possibility of support to companies therefore with contractual obligations, with times of intervention, definite correction times of which we fail to speak.

Just answer  "we are not interested", "we can not afford it", "it costs too much for us" ... or "we can provide you with an answer on that date" ...

No aggressiveness in my remarks. Style can be a little direct because of a limited but assumed mastery of English.

Maybe there are third-party companies that offer such a contract to secure the use of such a tool. That exists for Qt and I contacted 2 for Delphi. The only problem(not for Qt) is their ability to intervene on bugs .

Looking forward to reading you,
Regards. Gilles
« Last Edit: June 23, 2017, 09:17:19 am by GillesH »

mig-31

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2017, 09:58:04 am »
For example, look Linux, gcc development model. Companies employ developers who work on the project: propose, implement new features etc. and automaticly you get a support from these developers.
Lazarus 2.2.6 - OpenSuse Leap 15.4, Mageia 8, CentOS 7

GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2017, 03:02:23 pm »
Hello Mig,

I do not really understand what you said (probably my bad level of english). I used Lazarus for a long time when I was a teacher. But now manager of a small development company, I am not looking for an academic model, but a business model.

Anyway, I will not leave my codes in all hands, although I am able to encapsulate codes and components without giving their source. But that would be a financial charge. In France, we already have enough expenses not to add others !

So the intervention of third parties seems to me indispensable, that of the editor or the designer of the IDE is certainly the best solution. But for the safety and the sustainability of each, the "framework" of the interventions must be defined by contract. It's what I am looking for.

For example, I'm looking for a component to generate pdf. Here is my request of 02 November in the sub-forum "Lazarus » Miscellaneous » Jobs".

There was no contract, perhaps just a possibility. Yet I proposed. I'm still without such a component. I address myself to whom now ? I assign one of my developers to this work ? - developper, who I remember , is working primarily on Qt.  Totally unprofitable.

Currently, the worry is that I wonder how I could work with Lazarus without condemning neither my security to develop nor the profitability of our work. All the more so as I recall that for now, the search for a 2nd IDE is "to guarantee our backs" if Qt was a problem.

Regards. Gilles
« Last Edit: June 23, 2017, 03:46:15 pm by GillesH »

Phil

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2017, 04:03:04 pm »
Hello,

How to install lazvcl-1.0 properly on a configuration macOS 10.12 – Lazarus 1.6.4 – fpc 3.0.2 ?

Where do you get the two libraries needed libvlc.dylib and libvlccore.dylib (compatible with Lazarus so 32 bits) ?
Thanks. Gilles

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/download-macosx.html

https://sourceforge.net/projects/vlc/?source=recommended

GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2017, 09:31:37 pm »
Thank you for your answer, Phil.

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/download-macosx.html
  • Unlikely this works. It is reasonable to assume that a 64-bit version will be installed with the dmg. And Lazarus only compiles in 32 bits... which is already problematic with many librariries proposed by default  >:D
  • Why install all the software while a few libraries are sufficient ?
Still I need to know :
  • What version of the VCL libraries are  compatible with the Lazarus component ?
  • If  these libraries are compatible with Mac OS 10.12.5
The better it would be a response from the creator of lazvcl-1.0 : https://github.com/alrieckert/lazarus/blob/master/components/vlc/lazvlc.lpk [7/11/2012 !] It was OS 10.8 (Mountain Lion).
Or another more recent approach ... and maintained. It's  economically absurd to use packages that are no longer maintained since eventually we are sure to become incompatible with the current OS. That is true for  Linux and Mac OS. The Windows programmers do not encountered this problem with their Windows API.

Regards. Gilles
« Last Edit: June 23, 2017, 09:43:34 pm by GillesH »

Phil

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2017, 12:03:41 am »
It's  economically absurd to use packages that are no longer maintained since eventually we are sure to become incompatible with the current OS. That is true for  Linux and Mac OS. The Windows programmers do not encountered this problem with their Windows API.

Then you should use the Mac "API", which means the frameworks that come with macOS. My rule of thumb is to use them as much as possible before looking around for alternatives. A complete list of macOS frameworks is here:

https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/MacOSX/Conceptual/OSX_Technology_Overview/SystemFrameworks/SystemFrameworks.html

Look those over and see if anything piques your interest.

You should be able to use most of them with the Lazarus Cocoa widgetset, but not the default Carbon widgetset. The Cocoa widgetset will also give you 64-bit support. Apple is taking the first steps to move entirely away from 32-bits. I would not create 32-bit software on Mac. (In fact, virtually no developer does, not for years - take a look in Activity Monitor on your Mac - everything except Lazarus is 64-bit.)

https://www.macobserver.com/news/64-bit-mac-app-store-2018/

Pascal interfaces based on the Yosemite header files (10.10) are here:

https://github.com/genericptr/

If you need frameworks introduced with El Capitan (10.11), such as Contacts or Metal, Ryan's parser on that site is available for that purpose.


GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2017, 10:50:15 am »
Hello Phil,
Thank you for these very interesting comments which require additional explanations... if I understand what you have written.

As I wrote we develop with Qt which does not pose a particular problem with the external libraries customary. We could build in 32-bit with Qt but as you write it is the 64-bit which is common in the Mac OS. So obviously we want to use the external libraries used in our Qt development with our 2nd IDE.

You think well that the first configuration of Lazarus that we try is the following screen capture.The first error encountered figure on the second screen capture. Perhaps it is trivial to resolve... as the use of gdb with Lazarus Mac OS.

With a little documentation, reliable sources... or better, a support contract, we will lose not our time, will eliminate immediately the "chimères" techniques" (technical chimeras ?).

In the meantime, we had nothing product in 64-bit with Lazarus for Mac OS 10.12.5 -64 bits.

Cordially. Gilles
« Last Edit: June 24, 2017, 10:59:38 am by GillesH »

DonAlfredo

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2017, 11:23:20 am »
Building Lazarus with cocoa for 64bit will not work !
But you can cross-compile from 32bit towards 64bit  (cocoa) very easy, if you have a cross-compiler.

Not wanting to advertise, but just for help, you could use fpcupdeluxe to install 32bit and a 64bit cross-compiler.

And, as a motivation towards cross: the 64bit cocoa version of fpcupdeluxe has been made by cross-compiling !

GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2017, 12:00:51 pm »
Building Lazarus with cocoa for 64bit will not work !
Not wanting to advertise, but just for help, you could use fpcupdeluxe to install 32bit and a 64bit cross-compiler.
And, as a motivation towards cross: the 64bit cocoa version of fpcupdeluxe has been made by cross-compiling !

Hello DonAlfredo, thank you for this informations.

Yes, this is the last track that I will follow. I never used fpcdeluxe.

If I understand the IDE fpcupdeluxe can therefore work natively in 64-bit?  in this case, can it build i64-bit code directly without cross compilation?
ADD 12:21 : Nothing friendly it seems. A cross compiler but not an IDE... without documentation unless a link which refers to fpcup, , in any case nothing that comes at the top of the list with "fpcdeluxe install". I sense that I will still wander : a consequence of the characteristic of the world Lazarus: Documentation dispersed, often non-update...It's not a criticism but a simple fact. It's very unproductive for the use of Lazarus/FPC

As regards Lazarus, it only works in a retro mode compatible on Mac Os X. I must cross-compiling despite an IDE that "works" on the platform native. And applying, I do not speak more of the Debugging with gdb.

Without desire polemics, by pragmatism (and in the respect of the progeny Delphi) :

Why not consider a Delphi approach. A single IDE Win32 and all the targets in the cross-compilation, it would save the means. With the limits of this approach because the debugging in cross-compilation is less competitive than native debugs.

Finally it is this that I have found with my old Delphi XE7. XE10 has perhaps made progress at this level http://Https://community.embarcadero.com/blogs/entry/debugger-hotfix-for-macos-sierra-and-the-ios-simulator)

Thank you again for all the assistance provided and the wealth of ideas.
Regards. Gilles.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2017, 12:31:02 pm by GillesH »

DonAlfredo

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2017, 12:33:43 pm »
Again, AFAIK, you cannot have Lazarus cocoa 64 bit !

Please use the 32bit version of fpcupdeluxe to install a 32bit FPC and Lazarus as base.
https://github.com/newpascal/fpcupdeluxe/releases/download/v1.4.0k/fpcupdeluxe-i386-darwin.app.zip

Use fpcupdeluxe to install FPC and Lazarus (trunk or stable or whatever).
Use fpcupdeluxe to build a cross-compiler for 64bit.

Start Lazarus, create an new application, choose x86_64 as target, set cocoa as widgetset, and compile !

DonAlfredo

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2017, 12:45:17 pm »
About your comment of the Delphi possibilities of compiling from Windows towards Mac OSX.

Again, you can use fpcupdeluxe to install FPC and Lazarus 32bit on Windows.
And cross-compile from Windows towards Mac.

As a matter of fact: all fpcupdeluxe binaries (except OpenBSD) are build this way.

GillesH

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2017, 01:11:58 pm »
Our responses are crossed.
But I leave as such.

Quote
Ok Don, I will not crack finally. I try.

First question :https://github.com/newpascal/fpcupdeluxe/releases/tag/v1.4.0k >> In my case what release to choose? I have tried 4. In all cases, I do not access the button (grayed).

Second question : All files are in the directory ~/fpcdeluxetmp which I have all the permissions. fpcupdeluxe >> ERROR: File creation error: Access violation. Only explanation: The application attempts to create the configuration files outside of this directory. But where ?

Thanks. Gilles

I am really bad in English. My translation must be erroneous. Would you recommend me in OS X.12 to use Windows in my Virtual Box to cross-compile a version OS X.12 of Lazarus ?

If this is the case, I understand why the programers choose Qt and Java. This seems to me crazy!  I accept already poorly to run Delphi in a Virtualbox to build projects in Mac Desktop, but that, if a new times I have well understood, it's the "Pompom" ! And when I have a problem to the compilation or the debugging of a project, what assistance company will accept to help me? And this is going to cost us a fortune ! :o  I understand why assistance is difficult to find.

Visibly Lazarus seems not to be the "product" that I seek.
In any case, I thank you very much for the time you have given to me.

Regards. Gilles.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2017, 01:21:11 pm by GillesH »

DonAlfredo

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Re: lazvcl-1.0 and macOS 10.12
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2017, 01:23:54 pm »
Quote
Visibly Lazarus seems not to be the "product" that I seek.

Yes, this is your freedom ! There are many alternatives.

 

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