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Poll

Do you use the Dutch translation of the Lazarus IDE?

(Almost) always
2 (7.7%)
Only for debugging/developing the IDE
3 (11.5%)
(Almost) never
21 (80.8%)

Total Members Voted: 26

Voting closed: June 13, 2017, 11:15:25 pm

Author Topic: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE  (Read 5049 times)

jc99

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Re: Poll: Usage of Ducth translation for IDE
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2017, 07:06:16 pm »
 ;D BTW the poll asks if you use "Ducth" language, even native dutch-speaker would normally never use that.  ;)
.... are non-dutch-speaking people supposed to vote ?
then how about a "I use another non-english translation"-entry or "i am not dutch-speaking"-entry
to the voting, so you have a more speaking result, since this thread is in a general (non dutch area).
Greetings from germany
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Thaddy

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2017, 07:26:15 pm »
Maybe he meant Duckish. Quack. Well spotted. None of us did.... {$macro on} {$define Ducth := Dutch}
« Last Edit: May 15, 2017, 07:29:54 pm by Thaddy »
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

Bart

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #17 on: May 15, 2017, 10:49:57 pm »
The question should be:
If the translation was 100% correct, would you use it ?

Good point.
Voters: please comment.

Bart

Bart

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #18 on: May 15, 2017, 10:53:48 pm »
'Ongemerkt' heb ik ooit als taal Nederlands gekozen en dat is die nog steeds. Inderdaad zijn veel teksten niet omgezet, maar dat zit me (blijkbaar) niet in de weg.
Ik heb tijd en gelegenheid om aan de vertaling mee te werken.

Goed om te horen.

(Ik heb even gezocht, maar niet gevonden: kan ik makkelijk omschakelen van Nederlands naar een andere taal?).

Menu->Huplmiddelen->Options (yeah)->Omgeving->Algemeen->Taal

Bart

Bart

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Re: Poll: Usage of Ducth translation for IDE
« Reply #19 on: May 15, 2017, 10:55:00 pm »
;D BTW the poll asks if you use "Ducth" language, even native dutch-speaker would normally never use that.  ;)

 :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[

Bart

rvk

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #20 on: May 15, 2017, 10:59:07 pm »
Nope, even if the translation was 100% perfect I wouldn't use it (unless everyone else would use it, and with that I mean also the non-Dutch speaking  8-) )

Fact remains that English is the main communication language for programming and also here on the forum. Thaddy already showed that with the remark "daar heb je het al:" when trying to explain how to set the language in the Lazarus IDE.

Thaddy

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2017, 07:05:02 am »
- An IDE in Dutch will always clash with programming terminology at some point. Actually many points. Which will confuse people.
- An IDE in Dutch has imho merits only for beginners and educational purposes. It is good for educational purposes if the translation is of high quality. That means working from a translation dictionary  database, like based on MS. That would ensure familiarity.
- If you want to do it right, you would also need an effort to translate the manuals and help files into Dutch. That's not feasible. Unless you are Tantalus or Sisyphus.(Forgot which one,maybe both apply)
- Offering support on it would probably also need a Dutch language forum

Personally, I actively discourage its use. I don't see the point to invest loads of time on what convincingly appears to be a niche anyway.
There are 100ths of Dutch Lazarus users. If 100 of them actually use it, It may be an option that 10 of them contribute in some way.
I don't think that is going to happen.

So no. Even with a perfect translation I don't see many advantages. Only disadvantages. Note that within the Dutch educational system children are taught the English language from an age of 10. On some elementary schools even earlier (I have a 8 year old daughter and she already has English lessons).
So even for children as young as that it does not add much value, if any.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2017, 09:14:59 am by Thaddy »
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

jadev

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2017, 10:38:14 am »
Hai Bart,

In reactie op je oproep: nee, ook als de vertaling 100% goed zou zijn zou ik geen NL-instelling gebruiken.

In response to your request: no, even if the translation would be 100% accurate I still wouldn't use it.

Thaddy

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2017, 11:34:07 am »
@Bart
Quote
Menu->Huplmiddelen->Options (yeah)->Omgeving->Algemeen->Taal


"Huplmiddelen" Now let me guess..
« Last Edit: May 16, 2017, 11:36:12 am by Thaddy »
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

jacobb

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2017, 11:37:33 am »
I also never use Dutch and that doesn't depend on the quality of the translation. It's the same as with a lot of other programs I use.
The default language in most communities is English and if you need to research a certain problem the most likely language to find information in is English.

marcov

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #25 on: May 16, 2017, 12:27:22 pm »
That and the fact that there wasn't even an attempt to standardize IT jargon in Dutch after the early eighties, magazines and paper don't use it and have no guidelines to tap.

So that means that every Dutch translation is an own island.


Thaddy

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2017, 12:48:45 pm »
That and the fact that there wasn't even an attempt to standardize IT jargon in Dutch after the early eighties, magazines and paper don't use it and have no guidelines to tap.
That's not true.
CEH or its predecessor (no not the certified hackers, but a kind of platform for technology), initiated by the ministry of economic affairs, raised a work-group to address that issue in about 1997.
It never came to full fruition.  Reason: the members from the private sector and the academics weren't very interested and the civil servants were not in any way qualified.
Much like it is now... <Sigh> I must have some docs lying around, because it was in my PerfectView days. I know for sure Vincent Evers and Peter Backer gave a lot of feedback then.

Half of what I know about user interfaces (and internationalization) was taught to me by Peter Backer. The other half based on books he recommended. Like "About Face" which also has some insightful texts about translations. (SO ON TOPIC)

So there was an(actually multiple: there was also a linguistic group involved from Leiden) effort that bled to death.
We should really pay more taxes if the government promises to spend it on in-house IT knowledge. (Honestly!)
But that would go on a balance sheet and doesn't look good (salary scales: is that per week or per day? No,it's per month.. No joke.I thought it was.. >:D) , instead of on the current account where you can make third party hire conveniently disappear... And in effect pay market rates.(I know how, I am also a political scientist as you know)
[Edit] it was CEP, doh. I'm getting old...
« Last Edit: May 16, 2017, 05:38:49 pm by Thaddy »
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

Bart

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #27 on: May 16, 2017, 10:27:36 pm »
@Bart
Quote
Menu->Huplmiddelen->Options (yeah)->Omgeving->Algemeen->Taal
"Huplmiddelen" Now let me guess..

Gereedschap dan?
Kun je vast ook een mooi plaatje bij vinden.

Bart

Thaddy

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« Last Edit: May 17, 2017, 04:07:36 am by Thaddy »
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

Bart

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Re: Poll: Usage of Dutch translation for IDE
« Reply #29 on: May 17, 2017, 07:22:44 pm »
Zo destructief is dat menu in lazarus toch ook niet?

Bart

 

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