Anybody using an Ergodox or TypeMatrix keyboard for programming?

[Graeme]

Is anybody here using an Ergodox or TypeMatrix 2030 keyboard for programming? What is your experience with them? I'm especially interested in the Ergodox feedback.

https://ergodox-ez.com/
http://typematrix.com/

I've been using the TypeMatrix 2030 (USB) with Dvorak key caps for over a year now, and generally love it. But I do switch on occasion back to my Filco Majestouch 2. I love "clicky" tactile keys.

http://www.keyboardco.com/keyboard/uk-filco-majestouch-2-tenkeyless-nkr-tactile-action-keyboard.asp

The TypeMatrix is very comfortable with the grid key layout and centred Enter and Backspaces keys, but I just wish I could move one or two keys around. Hence I have an Ergodox-EZ on order. That should give me the grid key layout, clicky tactile keys and 100% programmable layout. Sounds like the best of all words.

[Paul Breneman]

The ErgoDox uses a Teensy (as you mentioned a while ago in another thread about the Teensy) and here is the C code: https://github.com/jackhumbert/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/ergodox

You can probably reprogram the keyboard using Free Pascal; http://turbocontrol.com/simpleteensy.htm

Please let us know if you do!

[Graeme]

@Paul,
I got my Ergodox delivered an hour ago. Now let the fun begin. :-)

[eny]

One keyboard to rule them all.
After 24 years of service I still have not touched the 2 spares I have.
What window$ key?? 

[jwdietrich]

I think that the future is in dynamical keyboards fitted with a mini display on every key (e.g. the Optimus series by Art Lebedev). By this way, any change in keyboard layout can be immediately visualized. This is the optimal tool for developers.

[Graeme]

@eny:
As much as I love the Model M too, the newer mechanical keyboards are worthy replacements. My Filco Majestouch 2 is nice and heavy, compact and also has the very nice "clicky" keys.

@jwdietrich:
I've seen the Optimus on the Internet before, but with such mini screens, it pushes up the price tremendously (The Optimus costs $1500!). Also I don't know how nice the keypress will feel. As for changing layouts - if you touch type, you don't look at the keys anyway, so having anything displayed or printed on them doesn't actually mean much - hence I recommend totally blank keys.

Yesterday I received my Ergodox EZ with blacked out sculpted keys. I also included the adjustable feet and wrist pads for extra flexibility. 24 hours later, and I absolutely love this keyboard. Today I did actual work with it, and had to tweak the keymap layout three times to help improve my efficiency. The general alphabet and number row layout hasn't changed to what I was used to (Dvorak), so my typing didn't suffer much. It's the use of the arrow keys, PgUp, PgDn, F-keys etc where my muscle memory is slowing me down. But I'm sure in a week or so that will be a thing of the past.

I've also added a few customisations to help with the Object Pascal IDE's I use. eg: A single keypress now triggers Ctrl+F9 to compile my applications. My thumbs are also getting to type a bit more.

For those interested, here is my current v1.3 layout which I'll be using for the next week or two, then evaluate if any other tweaks should be made. Two weeks should be enough to give my brain and fingers time to learn new muscle memory.  One thing I'm thinking of doing, is moving the number row to the Programmer Dvorak layout - I used that many years ago, and it actually worked very nicely.

Anyway, here is the layout. There are 3 layers. The Basic Layer is the most used layer and defines all keys, macros, shortcuts etc. Then there is a Symbol Layer which can be toggled (temporary or permanently). eg: temporary toggle will be for me to get access to the F-keys. A permanent switch will be if I need a Numpad. The third layer is so I can get back my loved 3x2 cluster (Ins,Del,PgUp,PgDn,Home,End) and the inverted T cluster for arrow usage. This layer is only a temporary toggle layer - active while a dedicated key is pressed. I can also control the mouse pointer in this layer and do left/right mouse clicking. In Layers 1 onwards, if the key layout diagram shows a blank key, it means it uses the key mapping from Layer 0. Some of the layout tweaks were inspired by my trusty TypeMatrix 2030 (which is a very nice keyboard in its own right).

And to think, I'm just scratching the surface of how you can program the ErgoDox EZ keyboard! Reprogramming the keyboard is dead simple. Tweak a simple keymap.c source file, run make (5 second build time) and upload the new .hex file to the keyboard and the keyboard reboots itself (3 second job). 

Code: C  [Select][+][-]

1. /* Keymap 0: Basic layer
2.  *
3.  * ,--------------------------------------------------.           ,--------------------------------------------------.
4.  * |   =    |   1  |   2  |   3  |   4  |   5  | COPY |           | PASTE|   6  |   7  |   8  |   9  |   0  |   \    |
5.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+-------------|           |------+------+------+------+------+------+--------|
6.  * | Del    |   '  |   ,  |   .  |   P  |   Y  |  L1  |           | BkSp |   F  |   G  |   C  |   R  |   L  |   /    |
7.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------|      |           |      |------+------+------+------+------+--------|
8.  * | Tab    |   A  |   O  |   E  |   U  |   I  |------|           |------|   D  |   H  |   T  |   N  |S / L2|   -    |
9.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------| C+F9 |           | Enter|------+------+------+------+------+--------|
10.  * | LShift |:/Ctrl|   Q  |   J  |   K  |   X  |      |           |      |   B  |   M  |   W  |   V  |Z/Ctrl| RShift |
11.  * `--------+------+------+------+------+-------------'           `-------------+------+------+------+------+--------'
12.  *   |Grv/L2| Ins  |AltShf| Left | Right|                                       |  Up  | Down |   [  |   ]  | ~L1  |
13.  *   `----------------------------------'                                       `----------------------------------'
14.  *                                        ,-------------.       ,---------------.
15.  *                                        | App  | PScr |       | Alt  |Ctrl/Esc|
16.  *                                 ,------|------|------|       |------+--------+------.
17.  *                                 |      |      | Home |       | PgUp |        |      |
18.  *                                 |Space | L1   |------|       |------|  MEH   | Space|
19.  *                                 |      |      | End  |       | PgDn |        |      |
20.  *                                 `--------------------'       `----------------------'
21.  */
22. /* Keymap 1: Symbol Layer
23.  *
24.  * ,--------------------------------------------------.           ,--------------------------------------------------.
25.  * |        |  F1  |  F2  |  F3  |  F4  |  F5  |      |           |      |  F6  |  F7  |  F8  |  F9  |  F10 |   F11  |
26.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+-------------|           |------+------+------+------+------+------+--------|
27.  * |        |   !  |   @  |   {  |   }  |   |  |      |           |      |   Up |   7  |   8  |   9  |   *  |   F12  |
28.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------|      |           |      |------+------+------+------+------+--------|
29.  * |        |   #  |   $  |   (  |   )  |   `  |------|           |------| Down |   4  |   5  |   6  |   +  |        |
30.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------|      |           |      |------+------+------+------+------+--------|
31.  * |        |      |   ^  |   [  |   ]  |   ~  |      |           |      |   &  |   1  |   2  |   3  |   \  |        |
32.  * `--------+------+------+------+------+-------------'           `-------------+------+------+------+------+--------'
33.  *   |      |      |      |      |      |                                       |      |    . |   0  |   =  |      |
34.  *   `----------------------------------'                                       `----------------------------------'
35.  *                                        ,-------------.       ,-------------.
36.  *                                        |      | PScr |       |  Ins |      |
37.  *                                 ,------|------|------|       |------+------+------.
38.  *                                 |      |      |      |       |      |      |      |
39.  *                                 |      |      |------|       |------|      |      |
40.  *                                 |      |      |      |       |      |      |      |
41.  *                                 `--------------------'       `--------------------'
42.  */
43. /* Keymap 2: Media and mouse keys
44.  *
45.  * ,--------------------------------------------------.           ,--------------------------------------------------.
46.  * | Teensy |      |      |      |      |      |      |           |      |      |      |      |      |      |        |
47.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+-------------|           |------+------+------+------+------+------+--------|
48.  * |        |      |      | MsUp |      |      |      |           | PScr |      |  Ins | Home | PgUp |      |        |
49.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------|      |           |      |------+------+------+------+------+--------|
50.  * |        |      |MsLeft|MsDown|MsRght|      |------|           |------|      |  Del | End  | PgDn |      |        |
51.  * |--------+------+------+------+------+------|      |           |      |------+------+------+------+------+--------|
52.  * |        |      |      |      |      |      |      |           |      |      |      |  Up  |      |      |        |
53.  * `--------+------+------+------+------+-------------'           `-------------+------+------+------+------+--------'
54.  *   |      |      |      | Lclk | Rclk |                                       | Left | Down | Right|      |      |
55.  *   `----------------------------------'                                       `----------------------------------'
56.  *                                        ,-------------.       ,-------------.
57.  *                                        |      |      |       |      |      |
58.  *                                 ,------|------|------|       |------+------+------.
59.  *                                 |      |      |      |       |      |      |Brwser|
60.  *                                 | Lclk | Rclk |------|       |------|      |Back  |
61.  *                                 |      |      |      |       |      |      |      |
62.  *                                 `--------------------'       `--------------------'
63.  */
64.  

[eny]

@eny:
As much as I love the Model M too, the newer mechanical keyboards are worthy replacements. My Filco Majestouch 2 is nice and heavy, compact and also has the very nice "clicky" keys.

True.
A friend of mine has a Razer Blackwidow Ultimate which is a cool looking keyboard as well.

[JuhaManninen]

+1 for mechanical keyboards from me!
Actually the term "mechanical keyboard" is misleading because all keyboards are mechanical except for capacitive, resistive or optical touchscreen virtual keyboards.
Anyway, I now have a Razer Blackwidow Tournament edition:
 http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-keyboards-keypads/razer-blackwidow-tournament-edition
which is a narrow tenkeyless (no number pad), similar to Graeme's UK Filco Majestouch-2.
Wow, the feeling and accuracy is better than in the old classic IBM keyboard!
Recommended!

I while ago I didn't know of this "mechanical keyboard" classification but I just wanted to find a narrow keyboard.
I never use the number pad. It only forces me to keep my mouse far away and switching between keyboard and mouse gets clumsy. Uhhh

I have understood almost nobody uses the number pad. Or maybe accountants use it but most computer users are not accountants. Still all "normal" keyboards have it. Yet another historical remain I guess.
I am interested, does anybody here use the number pad of their keyboards?

I tried to find a cheapish narrow keyboard but there isn't any. Only choices were the rather expensive "mechanical keyboards".
I bought it and I am very happy I did!
I renewed my other gadgets, too, for minimalistic but with high quality: Computer is ASRock Beebox and mouse is Steelseries Kinzu v3.
Both the keyboard and the mouse are advertized for games but their properties help with other usages, too.
With a good monitor this all makes a very functional and elegant computing experience.

The cheap computer package offerings are depressing. The computer itself may be OK, but mouse and keyboard are often inferior. A very cheap keyboard typically leaves out key-presses because the mechanism jams with slight horizontal forces. It is a pain to use and must be thrown away. Why are they made? There is enough garbage already in the world.

[Graeme]

Okay, some more feedback on my Ergodox experience.  I never knew that the Object Pascal IDEs (all of them) seem to use very unusual key combinations not found in other languages. eg: I use Ctrl+<arrows> (with and without Shift) and Ctrl+<F-keys> (again with and without Shift) a LOT!  My initial Ergodox layouts played havoc with that.

In my frustration, I switched back to my Filco just to get some work done. After only using Ergodox for 2-3 days, my old keyboard felt so awkward to type on, I immediately switched back to the Ergodox.    Time to rethink my problem key combinations, and what 20+ years of muscle memory taught me.

This is what I came up with. The commit message describes my changes and why I made them. Good news is that my vital keys and key combinations can now be accessed without switching layers. Back to work... lets see how this change pans out.

latest changes:
  https://github.com/graemeg/qmk_firmware/commit/806d90a0

Code: C  [Select][+][-]

1. /* Keymap 0: Basic layer
2.  *
3.  * ╭────────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────╮           ╭──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬────────╮
4.  * │  Esc   │  1  !│  2  @│  3  #│  4  $│  5  %│ INS  │           │ DEL  │  6  ^│  7  &│  8  *│  9  (│  0  )│   \   |│
5.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤           ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
6.  * │  Tab   │  '  "│  ,  <│  .  >│  P   │   Y  │ Del  │           │ BkSp │   F  │   G  │   C  │   R  │   L  │   /   ?│
7.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤      │           │      ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
8.  * │  =/+   │A /~L2│   O  │   E  │  U • │   I  ├──────┤           ├──────┤   D  │ • H  │   T  │   N  │S /~L2│   ─   _│
9.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤ C+F9 │           │ Enter├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
10.  * │ LShift │;/Ctrl│   Q  │   J  │  K   │   X  │      │           │      │   B  │   M  │   W  │   V  │Z/Ctrl│ RShift │
11.  * ╰─┬──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┴──────╯           ╰──────┴──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┬─╯
12.  *   │ Ctrl │  Alt │ CUT  │ COPY │ PASTE│                                       │ Left │  Up  │ Down │ Right│ SLCK │
13.  *   ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯                                       ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯
14.  *                                        ╭──────┬──────╮       ╭──────┬────────╮
15.  *                                        │Home  │ End  │       │ CAPS │Ctrl/Esc│
16.  *                                 ╭──────┼──────┼──────┤       ├──────┼────────┼──────╮
17.  *                                 │      │      │ Apps │       │ PgUp │        │      │
18.  *                                 │ BkSp │ ~L1  ├──────┤       ├──────┤  ~L1   │ Space│
19.  *                                 │      │      │ PScr │       │ PgDn │        │      │
20.  *                                 ╰──────┴──────┴──────╯       ╰──────┴────────┴──────╯
21.  */
22. /* Keymap 1: Symbol Layer
23.  *
24.  * ╭────────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────╮           ╭──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬────────╮
25.  * │        │  F1  │  F2  │  F3  │  F4  │  F5  │      │           │      │  F6  │  F7  │  F8  │  F9  │ F10  │  F11   │
26.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤           ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
27.  * │        │  !   │  @   │  {   │  }   │  |   │      │           │      │      │  7   │  8   │  9   │  *   │  F12   │
28.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤      │           │      ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
29.  * │        │  #   │  $   │  (   │  )   │  `   ├──────┤           ├──────┤      │  4   │  5   │  6   │  +   │        │
30.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤      │           │      ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
31.  * │        │      │  ^   │  [   │  ]   │  ~   │      │           │      │      │  1   │  2   │  3   │  \   │        │
32.  * ╰─┬──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┴──────╯           ╰──────┴──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┬─╯
33.  *   │      │      │      │      │      │                                       │  0   │  00  │  .   │  =   │      │
34.  *   ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯                                       ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯
35.  *                                        ╭──────┬──────╮       ╭──────┬────────╮
36.  *                                        │      │      │       │      │        │
37.  *                                 ╭──────┼──────┼──────┤       ├──────┼────────┼──────╮
38.  *                                 │      │      │      │       │      │        │      │
39.  *                                 │      │      ├──────┤       ├──────┤        │      │
40.  *                                 │      │      │      │       │      │        │      │
41.  *                                 ╰──────┴──────┴──────╯       ╰──────┴────────┴──────╯
42.  */
43. /* Keymap 2: Media and mouse keys
44.  *
45.  * ╭────────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────╮           ╭──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬──────┬────────╮
46.  * │ Teensy │      │      │      │      │      │      │           │      │      │      │      │      │      │        │
47.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤           ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
48.  * │        │      │      │ MsUp │      │      │      │           │      │      │      │ Home │ PgUp │      │        │
49.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤      │           │      ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
50.  * │        │      │MsLeft│MsDown│MsRght│      ├──────┤           ├──────┤      │      │ End  │ PgDn │      │        │
51.  * ├────────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┤      │           │      ├──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼────────┤
52.  * │        │      │      │      │      │      │      │           │      │      │ Home │  Up  │ End  │      │        │
53.  * ╰─┬──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┴──────╯           ╰──────┴──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┼──────┬─╯
54.  *   │      │      │      │      │      │                                       │ Left │ Down │ Right│      │      │
55.  *   ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯                                       ╰──────┴──────┴──────┴──────┴──────╯
56.  *                                        ╭──────┬──────╮       ╭──────┬────────╮
57.  *                                        │      │      │       │      │        │
58.  *                                 ╭──────┼──────┼──────┤       ├──────┼────────┼──────╮
59.  *                                 │      │      │      │       │      │        │Brwser│
60.  *                                 │ LClk │ RClk ├──────┤       ├──────┤        │ Back │
61.  *                                 │      │      │      │       │      │        │      │
62.  *                                 ╰──────┴──────┴──────╯       ╰──────┴────────┴──────╯
63.  */
64.  

With my new arrow layout in Layer 0 (base layer), I'll probably not be using the arrow setup in Layer 2 any more.

URL to always view my latest layout:
  https://github.com/graemeg/qmk_firmware/tree/gg_dvorak

[Graeme]

Actually the term "mechanical keyboard" is misleading...

By that I believe they compare it to other key technologies like the "rubber dome" keys which are very spongy. The other alternative is "scissor switches" (which the TypeMatrix uses). The latter is already a big improvement over the rubber dome switches, but definitely not as good as mechanical switches.

The other plus point of mechanical switches is that each key has its own switch (hence the more expensive price point), but that means that if a switch stops working, you can simply replace that individual switch - no need to bin your keyboard.

Anyway, I now have a Razer Blackwidow Tournament edition:

That has a very nice look indeed.

which is a narrow tenkeyless (no number pad), similar to Graeme's UK Filco Majestouch-2.

Even though I bought it from a UK website, I ordered the US layout. I prefer the $, \ and / key locations on a US layout.

I am interested, does anybody here use the number pad of their keyboards?

Hell no!  I never use those. In fact, in all my working history I only know of one developer (from my previous employment) that actually used the numpad - everybody else I met over the years never uses it.

And like you said, removing the num keypad brings your mouse closer to the keyboard and you can have the keyboard more centered in front of you.

I renewed my other gadgets, too, for minimal but high quality: Computer is ASRock Beebox and mouse is Steelseries Kinzu v3.

I mostly use a trackball, instead of a mouse. Mine is the Logitech M570. It uses the thumb to roll the wheel. It takes 2-3 days to get used to it (thumb muscles will be felt after day one), but then it works brilliantly. It takes up less desk space, doesn't require the awkward mouse mats, and obviously never moves around. The M570 is wireless and uses only one AA battery that has been lasting for 2 years (with daily office usage) and still has 60% battery remaining! (Apple, try and beat that with your battery guzzling Magic Mouse - my wife had to replace batteries every 3 weeks).

[Paul Breneman]

I am interested, does anybody here use the number pad of their keyboards?

Yes, but I use it for a lot of cursor control, not for numeric entry!  I've used Kedit as my text editor since 1985 (under wine on Linux) and my favorite site concerning text editors is this: http://www.softpanorama.org/Articles/orthodox_editors.shtml

I use smaller Logitech keyboards that have the number pad but the cursor section is missing.

Like Graeme I use the Logitech M570 trackball, and my wireless keyboard works on the same system.

[Graeme]

The keys felt comfortable but the red label is too eye catching.

Microsoft has always loved their warning labels. The same goes for motorcycle manufacturers. They place those labels and stickers in the worst places possible. I rip them off the first chance I get.