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Author Topic: What is CodeTyphon ?  (Read 16114 times)

Handoko

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2017, 09:39:47 am »
CodeTyphon is not Lazarus, so I think you can install CodeTyphon without uninstall Lazarus.

You may try this tool:
http://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,28897.msg246231.html#msg246231

majid.ebru

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2017, 12:11:18 am »
CodeTyphon is not Lazarus

i know but the codetyphon opened my project and compiled it?!?


i uninstall lazarus and install CodeTyphon.
then i  open CodeTyphon IDE -->  Project --> open Project --> and i select and open my lazarus project and codeTyphon opens it ?!?!?


Handoko

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2017, 05:37:00 am »
Code Typhon uses Free Pascal to compile codes. It can be considered as a software fork of Lazarus/FPC:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fork_%28software_development%29

Because Lazarus and Free Pascal are open source, forking is allowed. Forking has both good and bad consequences. The bad is, Code Typhon has added many great improvements but it is hard to contribute back to Lazarus.

As an user, you can choose to use Lazarus or Code Typhon or both. Using both is hard (for me), because you have to make your code to compatible on both IDEs.

Simple Pascal codes that work on Lazarus should be able to compile on Code Typhon with little or no change. But large projects that use several visual components, the result may be different.

Thaddy

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2017, 09:52:21 am »
Code Typhon is also advertised as freeware on their website, but that is - again - a violation of the GPL and LGPL. Lazarus and FPC are open source, but licensed open source. CodeTyphon violates the licenses. You should be aware of that. As a product it has its merits, but I wish the developers would stick to the licenses.
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

marcov

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #19 on: June 20, 2017, 10:15:11 am »
Please not that discussion again. >:D

Thaddy

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2017, 10:33:41 am »
It keeps a bother, sorry...
"Logically, no number of positive outcomes at the level of experimental testing can confirm a scientific theory, but a single counterexample is logically decisive."

marcov

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2017, 11:00:54 am »
It keeps a bother, sorry...

I've no problem with you complaining about it. I just have a problem with you complaining about it over and over again here. This forum is not meant as a stick to beat other projects with, take it to the CT forum where it belongs if it bothers you so much.

To answer the original question:  CT was originally a distribution of Lazarus with a lot of 3rd party code preinstalled and a lot of crosscompiling options out of the box.

Later they started to integrate some of those external packages into the lazarus code (rather than installable packages).

Later again they declared it a fork, but the exact status (how different it is, and if they still sync with Lazarus trunk) is not know since the project is not known for its transparency (licensewise or otherwise)

« Last Edit: June 20, 2017, 11:05:16 am by marcov »

Ondrej Pokorny

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2017, 11:24:57 am »
I checked CodeTyphoon last year and didn't find any license violation myself. Yes, it's not transparent - they mix 3rd party tools with different licenses so you have to check every used component yourself.

All in all, Lazarus is better :) Original is always the best.

JuhaManninen

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2017, 12:14:36 pm »
Code Typhon is also advertised as freeware on their website, but that is - again - a violation of the GPL and LGPL. Lazarus and FPC are open source, but licensed open source. CodeTyphon violates the licenses. You should be aware of that. As a product it has its merits, but I wish the developers would stick to the licenses.
Thaddy, that is not true as I have explained you in this same forum:
  http://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,34602.msg228918.html#msg228918
Then I used 2 days studying CodeTyphon project and the GPL itself.
PilotLogic has made a separate freeware product which is closed source. They have not changed the license on their Lazarus fork.

For some reason some (not all but some) people are attracted for hating things. The flame wars against CodeTyphon escalated into surreal proportions. The main agitator, a horrible hate-blocker, got no penalty or consequencies. His ugly blogs full of lies are still there. He has many respected people as followers. He can mix lies, facts and opinions in an aggressive but convincing way in his blogs. That's apparently enough, people don't bother checking facts when they can hate something. When a positive view is presented, people are much more critical and want to check facts.

False information, "extended reality", "alternative facts", however it is called, seems to be the norm of today. But it is still wrong! We should have a zero-tolerance for this phenomenon in this forum.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2017, 12:19:21 pm by JuhaManninen »

marcov

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #24 on: June 20, 2017, 02:03:45 pm »
I checked CodeTyphoon last year and didn't find any license violation myself. Yes, it's not transparent - they mix 3rd party tools with different licenses so you have to check every used component yourself.

As far as I know it hinges on two things:
  • removing of original copyright messages on 3rd party code. In my logs I kept an url to post of a original copyrightholder saying he didn't consent;User minesadorada says that about screen and the copyright line was removed from his longtimer package: (two posts on the urls:) http://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,34602.msg228775.html#msg228775
  • recycling dxscene/VGscene as pl_Orca.  This is complicated as older versions of these codebases are said to have been available as MPL based package. It is not clear what the CT versions are based on. While several people have compared orca vs *scene sources and say they are very similar, the problem is that such comparisons might also be similar if it is based on the older open source package, so not absolute proof without very precise information and testing circumstances (e.g. compare to both open source and commercial versions) If CT also stripped copyright info on it, that is wrong, but then point 2 is equal to already named point one

I also heard that CT did try to reinstate some original headers after the first allegations, so the current status is even more unknown as the old state. It will also makes a "good will"  defence against any bad faith allegations based on a single violation.

So you can't check anything without making a list of original sources and comparing the copyright headers. And the vgscene case is even more complicated.

turrican

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2017, 03:22:45 pm »
My 0.05 cents :

I used Codepython and discovered that project is good and easy to go. But this is a fork of Lazarus hard modified and this is terrible for original Lazarus comunity so I left Codetyphon immediately.

Now to manage all about cross-compilers I prefer NewPascal. More polite and respects Lazarus and FPC communities.

JuhaManninen

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #26 on: June 20, 2017, 03:31:15 pm »
Marcov, true, removing copyright messages from the few components was so stupid because they didn't benefit anyhow by doing so, but it gave an excuse for some people to attack them.
They were not many, I saw names of only 3 or 4 components. Maybe they are also fixed already, don't know.

However I did not find license violations against Lazarus except for those 2 minor ones (in the other thread). It is a big contrast against the wild accusations that were flying around. Like "they removed license info from LCL" or "they do not publish their modified sources".
Anybody could have checked the facts but many people didn't. They just repeated the lies. It is quite horrible...

If anybody finds more license violations by CodeTyphon against Lazarus, strictly based on license, please send me a PM. We can add them to a list for future reference when the issue rises up again.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2017, 04:42:28 pm by JuhaManninen »

JuhaManninen

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #27 on: June 20, 2017, 03:37:58 pm »
But this is a fork of Lazarus hard modified and this is terrible for original Lazarus comunity so I left Codetyphon immediately.
Forking is a freedom provided by GPL. Nothing wrong with it.
The license does not dictate that the people who copied code must co-operate with the original project, or offer their changes back to it.
It only dictates that the modified source code must be published when binaries built from it are delivered. That rule has been followed very well.
Please do not pull arbitrary requirements from your hat for CodeTyphon. The license (GPL) must be the only guideline.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2017, 04:41:01 pm by JuhaManninen »

turrican

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2017, 05:17:08 pm »
Thanks for your explanation,

I don't hate CodeTyphon simply I IMHO don't trust on fork everything and not contribute/forget the original project. I prefer to work with a bigger involved community project than a closed one.

;)

Akira1364

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Re: What is CodeTyphon ?
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2017, 03:20:49 am »
Not going to get into my personal opinions too much, but just to state some facts:

1) CodeTyphon is not "closed source", not even slightly. All the source for everything (each and every component, the IDE, their fork of FPC, e.t.c) is included with the download. The ONLY exception to this is the fact that the source for their standalone "CodeTyphon Center" updater/installation/package manager application is not available, which isn't particularly relevant to the discussion as it is an entirely original application by PilotLogic that does not exist at all for Lazarus.

2) The vast majority of their versions of the packages they bundle are objectively better than the originals and contain various non-trivial bugfixes, sometimes to the extent that the original package may have not even worked at all, but the CodeTyphon version does.

3) The CodeTyphon IDE itself does in fact come with no less than five entire palette-tabs worth of their own in-house controls that are not available anywhere else (ExControls1, ExControls2, e.t.c)

4) Their docked form designer (which is again something they developed entirely from scratch) has always been and continues to be significantly better than the Lazarus "Sparta" docked form designer in pretty much every way.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2017, 03:43:56 am by Akira1364 »

 

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